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      12-14-2017, 12:53 PM   #177
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobysaurus View Post
It looks more like an elevated wagon than an SUV. If they're gonna call it an SUV it should at least be able to perform decently off-road like the Range Rover.
As already noted above, they don't call it an SUV, technically. They call it an SAV.

But wait a minute. Why does it even matter what they call it, when the term SUV is routinely applied to most any type of SUV-like vehicle on the market?

https://www.autotrader.com/car-shopp...ference-215843

"The result is that the term 'SUV' is often applied to both crossovers and SUVs."

Quote:
Saying "well most owners never take it off-road anyway" is stupid because I don't see Land Rover becoming complacent for such silly reasons. If it's not meant to go off-road just call it a CUV, not an SUV. Just another bloated crossover wagon like the Infiniti JX/QX60, GMC Acadia and the Lincoln MKT. I'm seriously disappointed
Stupid? Really?

Yeah, either that or you could opt not to be nearly so pedantic, and we can end the discussion here rather than wandering needlessly and hopelessly off topic.

Can I get everyone to agree to that?
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      12-14-2017, 01:01 PM   #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobysaurus View Post
It looks more like an elevated wagon than an SUV. If they're gonna call it an SUV it should at least be able to perform decently off-road like the Range Rover.
As already noted above, they don't call it an SUV, technically. They call it an SAV.

But wait a minute. Why does it even matter what they call it, when the term SUV is routinely applied to most any type of SUV-like vehicle on the market?

https://www.autotrader.com/car-shopp...ference-215843

"The result is that the term 'SUV' is often applied to both crossovers and SUVs."

Quote:
Saying "well most owners never take it off-road anyway" is stupid because I don't see Land Rover becoming complacent for such silly reasons. If it's not meant to go off-road just call it a CUV, not an SUV. Just another bloated crossover wagon like the Infiniti JX/QX60, GMC Acadia and the Lincoln MKT. I'm seriously disappointed
Stupid? Really?

Yeah, either that or you could opt not to be nearly so pedantic, and we can end the discussion here rather than wandering needlessly and hopelessly off topic.

Can I get everyone to agree to that?
I remember when the dealer was actually ordering my first 2014 F15 their own BMW German system said SUV somewhere (where he was clicking), he started laughing because BMW makes such a huge deal about SAV. Also ceramic controls in europe order are still misspelled cermaic till today.
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      12-14-2017, 01:15 PM   #179
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Geez... it actually looks a billion times better than that atrocious concept. Maybe there is hope. As somebody with 3 little kids I am always in the market for bigger SUVs (currently have an LR4), and now this may creep in to the options I'd consider. Amazing I'm even saying that after how bad I thought the concept was.
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      12-14-2017, 01:26 PM   #180
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      12-14-2017, 01:30 PM   #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BwoodBMW View Post
Geez... it actually looks a billion times better than that atrocious concept. Maybe there is hope. As somebody with 3 little kids I am always in the market for bigger SUVs (currently have an LR4), and now this may creep in to the options I'd consider. Amazing I'm even saying that after how bad I thought the concept was.
Amazing , but surprisingly common. Props to you for even acknowledging your own error.

It's great that we have things like spyshots, but making kneejerk decisions on styling, or buying decisions based on the appearance of a vehicle in spyshots... really simply leads to folly. You can't judge a vehicle from a concept or.. a spyshot... it's an old BMW adage I am sure.
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      12-14-2017, 01:31 PM   #182
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I just hope BMW realizes that if they make this car actually fun to drive (relative to the gls) and not just copy the gls they will sweep the segment easily. BMW has just been so damn conservative they only try to equal the competition in recent memory.

This segment is just waiting for a legitimate performance class leader, as none exists right now.
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      12-14-2017, 01:35 PM   #183
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Poor scoobysaurus...he posted that a year ago!

SUV, SAV, Crossover, Ute...they are all utility whales...on or off-road...doesn't matter what you call them. The X7 is a "LUV"...Luxury Utility Vehicle.

To get back on topic and not hash out a post from a year ago...this mule looks so much more promising...including the (hopefully) chrome Armageddon and "hockey stick" delete. That's how bad the concept was.
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      12-14-2017, 01:40 PM   #184
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kozzi View Post
Poor scoobysaurus...he posted that a year ago!

SUV, SAV, Crossover, Ute...they are all utility whales...on or off-road...doesn't matter what you call them. The X7 is a "LUV"...Luxury Utility Vehicle.

To get back on topic and not hash out a post from a year ago...this mule looks so much more promising...including the (hopefully) chrome Armageddon and "hockey stick" delete. That's how bad the concept was.
https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...overs-and-suvs

cars
pickup trucks
SUVs - Tahoe, Durango, Expedition etc
Crossovers (includes SAV) all BMW SAV, all Porsche SAV , Jaguar F pace , Afla Romeo Stelvio, etc

As far as I am concerned.. these are the current classes of vehicles.

An SUV is not the same an SAV/Crossover. An SUV would never be seen on a track...well.. not anymore than a pickup truck would.
An SAV/Crossover certainly has the potential to actually even be very fun on a track..

PS. you should probably trademark LUV. or technically LAV.. because I bet BMW AG would be interested..

Last edited by M3 Adjuster; 12-14-2017 at 01:46 PM..
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      12-14-2017, 01:44 PM   #185
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Wow the return of proper roof rails

Imagine that
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      12-14-2017, 01:52 PM   #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...overs-and-suvs

cars
pickup trucks
SUVs
Crossovers (includes SAV)

As far as I am concerned.. these are the current classes of vehicles.

An SUV is not the same an SAV/Crossover. An SUV would never be seen on a track...well.. not anymore than a pickup truck would.
An SAV/Crossover certainly has the potential to actually even be very fun on a track..

PS. you should probably trademark LUV. or technically LAV.. because I bet BMW AG would be interested..
I do not disagree. I was making a general statement about these class of "utility" vehicles and poking fun with the term LUV. I have always considered my X3s "SAVs"

BTW..."LAV" is all yours...what's the acronym? Luxury Activity Vehicle?
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      12-14-2017, 02:56 PM   #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
An SUV is not the same an SAV/Crossover.
As the article I linked to above points out, that doesn't apply anymore. Language has evolved and as such, the reality is that, colloquially, everything is called an SUV now. Time to accept it and move on. If you guys are that interested in continuing, I can easily move the discussion. Let me know.

Quote:
An SUV would never be seen on a track...well.. not anymore than a pickup truck would.

An SAV/Crossover certainly has the potential to actually even be very fun on a track..
The Grand Cherokee Trackhawk would beg to differ. Plenty of 500hp+ LRs would be fun on a track, too.
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      12-14-2017, 03:29 PM   #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c63er View Post
I just hope BMW realizes that if they make this car actually fun to drive (relative to the gls) and not just copy the gls they will sweep the segment easily. BMW has just been so damn conservative they only try to equal the competition in recent memory.

This segment is just waiting for a legitimate performance class leader, as none exists right now.
My guess is that it's going to be the same story as the 7 series to the S class dynamically.

Handles slightly better but really not any difference a buyer will actually be able to experience.
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      12-14-2017, 03:47 PM   #189
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If I was to get something this huge, I would purchased a Range Rover. But they need to make it because the demand is here in the U.S. for a third row seating like the Volvo XC 90 and other large American SUVs.

BMW you're gonna need to redesign the exterior quickly, make it more sleeker, more German looking. And you must remove the hockey stick, even dealers were commenting how absurd it looks. I just saw the hockey stick on the new seven series in person in a showroom, totally ugly and unnecessary. Why??? Why anyone especially a designer would think that would look good. Who okayed that?!
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      12-14-2017, 04:14 PM   #190
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For Mercedes to build cars this big and practical it's in their DNA, after all they always built Trucks and the G wagon goes back to the 70's, for BMW to venture into this, it is simply marketing, just like they sacrificed the reputation for RWD for every day cars, and manage this with the X1, frankly pretty dam car with nothing special to waist the brand tradition.
I guess we can safely assume the engineering and sportiness of BMW's is certainly 2nd Marketing, just like Audi's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by c63er View Post
I just hope BMW realizes that if they make this car actually fun to drive (relative to the gls) and not just copy the gls they will sweep the segment easily. BMW has just been so damn conservative they only try to equal the competition in recent memory.

This segment is just waiting for a legitimate performance class leader, as none exists right now.
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      12-14-2017, 04:54 PM   #191
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c63er View Post
actually fun to drive (relative to the gls)
Might be the overstatement of the year if this beast of a vehicle is called "fun to drive". I would be happy with "not horrible" in a car that large
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      12-14-2017, 04:57 PM   #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ndukyh View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by c63er View Post
actually fun to drive (relative to the gls)
Might be the overstatement of the year if this beast of a vehicle is called "fun to drive". I would be happy with "not horrible" in a car that large
Remember when people said that about suvs before BMW taught the world something with the x5.

Of course that was a very different company, so you are right, not horrible might be considered a victory now.
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      12-14-2017, 06:09 PM   #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
As the article I linked to above points out, that doesn't apply anymore. Language has evolved and as such, the reality is that, colloquially, everything is called an SUV now. Time to accept it and move on. If you guys are that interested in continuing, I can easily move the discussion. Let me know.



The Grand Cherokee Trackhawk would beg to differ. Plenty of 500hp+ LRs would be fun on a track, too.

Even so... while colloquially... many people may call a convertible, a CAR... indeed... the name convertible still applies. When searching on a web site.. convertibles are often still listed separately.

the car and driver page actually calls them " Crossovers and SUVs.. " as does Cars.com and cargurus.com , NADA has BOTH categories.... as does KBB, Autoweek, and more..

I would LOVE to just take what you said as gospel.... but.. your link no worky for me.. . so i'll keep with what the majority of the market is doing for now


Edit: tried again and got the link to work


The last sentence reads...

"The only way you'll go wrong is by using the term "crossover" to define a body-on-frame SUV. Examples of such vehicles include the Chevrolet Tahoe, Ford Expedition and Mercedes G-Class. Those are all still SUVs in the original sense of the term -- and in those cases, "crossover" doesn't apply."

While manufacturers or people may use the term SUV for two types of vehicles , there are still two distinct categories of vehicles , and autorader (as well as the other online auto search engines ) certainly agree.

As a matter of fact, if you go back to my original post, you will see that I had edited it for clarity and the examples I used are the same ..

Last edited by M3 Adjuster; 12-14-2017 at 06:53 PM..
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      12-14-2017, 06:20 PM   #194
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If they will keep those huge nostrils they will get an award for sure. A bad one...
I still hope that there is some common sense left in the design department.

Just looked at the new X3 yesterday. Nice car overall and more pleasant as a whole , but not sure about the nostrils. Every time I said "yeah, nice, but those grills..."
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      12-14-2017, 06:25 PM   #195
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Does this whale have the same bones as the Culligan, I mean Cullinan? I hope the kidney grilles have been fixed. The concept car looks cartoonish.
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      12-14-2017, 06:31 PM   #196
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Was at the Performance Center today taking delivery, was told that pre-production has already started for the G07 in Hall 32 which was built specifically for the X7. Hall 51 (X5&X6) was also closed for customer tours. Hi
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      12-14-2017, 06:42 PM   #197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BwoodBMW View Post
Geez... it actually looks a billion times better than that atrocious concept. Maybe there is hope. As somebody with 3 little kids I am always in the market for bigger SUVs (currently have an LR4), and now this may creep in to the options I'd consider. Amazing I'm even saying that after how bad I thought the concept was.
...........hmmmm.....https://www.dodge.com/durango/srt.html
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      12-14-2017, 08:42 PM   #198
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Loads of body rolll on this pig-ass fucker.
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