[judec]

Originally Posted by T Bone

Hey even if my last name were Hilton, doesn't mean I am a slut.

great comment, LOL

[beepbeep]

Originally Posted by White05X3

OK...I have a dumb question. Sorry in advance if I am missing something here...

I think it was determined a while back that the thermostat for the oil cooler opens at 230F. Doesn't that mean that anything below that and the thermostat is closed, bypassing the cooler? If so, how was the Dinan oil cooler keeping the their test car below 230?

This is indeed the $2000 question. Something besides the price doesn't add up.

[Potty_Pants]

Originally Posted by beepbeep

This is indeed the $2000 question. Something besides the price doesn't add up.

Dinan stated their firmware update on the 335i changed the cooling... so they prob lowered when the fan/pump activates. I doubt our cars have the old thermostat... they prob have an electronically controlled one. So this would answer the lower cooling temps.

nobody is twisting our arms to buy this stuff... but Dinan should take their over priced ads elsewhere...

or offer something completely unheard of...

A GROUP BUY... but this was laughed off by someone at dinan in a previous post.

ppp

[2e9x's]

Moving away from price for a moment...

My other concern with this ad is that it does not really address whether or not the oil cooler solves the true problem. This car is not overheating during normal driving. It is not even having heat troubles during spirited street driving, especially when equipped with the factory oil cooler. Nor is the car running too hot (read inducing limp home mode) during hard street driving in really hot ambient temperatures.

Some people are overheating on the track (the ones where you turn the wheel sometimes). Dinan claims not to have tested their oil cooler at the track. Logically a larger, more efficient cooler SHOULD solve the problem. I am just disturbed that there is no data showing that their product actually solves the main problem.

On a side note...has anyone noticed that this car runs at whatever oil temperature it wants to, regardless of ambient temperatures? My car runs between 240 and 250 no matter how cold it is outside.

[orientblue3]

Gotta love Dinan spam posts. The mods should not let them be a sponsor if they are just going to spam the forum and not respond to the threads they create.

[bronco]

Originally Posted by Potty_Pants

Dinan stated their firmware update on the 335i changed the cooling... so they prob lowered when the fan/pump activates. I doubt our cars have the old thermostat... they prob have an electronically controlled one. So this would answer the lower cooling temps.

nobody is twisting our arms to buy this stuff... but Dinan should take their over priced ads elsewhere...

or offer something completely unheard of...

A GROUP BUY... but this was laughed off by someone at dinan in a previous post.

ppp

Potty - They laughed at me and my GROUP BUY suggestion....
I want to see how many people will actually buy the 2K oil cooler, and then I will gladly laugh at them for being stupid

This is ridiculous - This cooler pobably cost about $200.00...

[Potty_Pants]

Bronco,

If they wanted support, they jumped into the lions den with a meat suit.

The fact that Dinan hasnt responded tells me They CANT defend their prices, or are too COCKY and feel their prices are FAIR.

not worth ranting about, im not buying it.

ppp

[bronco]

Originally Posted by Potty_Pants

Bronco,

If they wanted support, they jumped into the lions den with a meat suit.

The fact that Dinan hasnt responded tells me They CANT defend their prices, or are too COCKY and feel their prices are FAIR.

not worth ranting about, im not buying it.

ppp

Exactly - I am not buying something that overpriced...
Oh well, maybe if it is made of gold

[gonzo]

I am buying 6 so I can get a D I N A N 3 badge for my car.
Then when the price goes up I can make lot's of money selling them.

[Orb]

Originally Posted by sambonator

But what if Dinan used an off-the-shelf heat exchanger that you can buy from Jegs for $162? Wholesale, maybe $120?

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...0002_193796_-1

I can't see the type of radiator of this one is from looking at this picture but I can usually spot the high performance designs. You can’t just throw something like this in without first knowing some parameters. One, would be pressure drop in the oil part of the heat exchanger. Pick one with a lot pressure drop and you could starve the engine for oil flow. Two, is the flow turblanet or laminar.... to much x section area slows down the flow and then we lose the ability to reject heat efficently by 20%. There is lot thing to consider if you want to do this right.

We implementing a product like this you have to be systematic and methodical in making sure you doing the right thing and in this case is doing a bit testing and packaging.

BTW, the stock oil cooler is made by Modine. This is medium performance design. You could make this design 20%-30% more efficient in the same size but at 2x the cost.

Orb

[beepbeep]

Originally Posted by Potty_Pants

Dinan stated their firmware update on the 335i changed the cooling... so they prob lowered when the fan/pump activates. I doubt our cars have the old thermostat... they prob have an electronically controlled one. So this would answer the lower cooling temps.

ppp

Good point. It is not an apples to apples comparison.

[beepbeep]

Originally Posted by White05X3

Moving away from price for a moment...

On a side note...has anyone noticed that this car runs at whatever oil temperature it wants to, regardless of ambient temperatures? My car runs between 240 and 250 no matter how cold it is outside.

That's the oil thermostat and where BMW wants it to run. That keeps water and the resulting acids from building up in the oil.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by Orb

I can't see type of radiator this one is from looking at this picture but I can usually spot the high performance designs. You can’t just throw something like this in without first knowing some parameters. One, would be pressure drop in the oil part of the heat exchanger. Pick the one with a lot pressure drop and you could starve the engine for oil flow rate. Two, is the flow turblanet or laminar.... to much x section area slows down the flow and then we lose the ability to reject heat efficently by 20%. There is lot thing to consider if you want to do this right.

We implementing a product like this you have to be systematic and methodical in making sure you doing the right thing and in this case is doing a bit testing packaging.

BTW, the stock oil cooler is made by Modine. This is medium performance design. You could make this design 20%-30% more efficient in the same size at 2x the cost.

Orb

Good posts on this Orb. People really have no idea what it takes to build a well performing reliable product.

I wonder if BMW will start selling a HP oil cooler??

[stressdoc]

I wondered about the asymmetry of having the OC on the right side, and was thinking that a good solution might be to add a second cooler on the left side to balance out the effect on the brake duct.

But for me this is a non-issue. I have run my 335 hard in summer heat and never gotten past the normal 240 degree level. I have a manual with the OEM oil cooler, and have done a bit of weight reduction. As I see it the Dinan OC is for folks with AT and no OEM OC. Looks like a good product. An OC may not be as sexy as new rims or spoilers, but if I had any hint of heat issues I would part with the 2k.

Water wetter and hi-tech oils (royal purple etc.) are good ideas regardless.

[e46e92love]

Originally Posted by White05X3

On a side note...has anyone noticed that this car runs at whatever oil temperature it wants to, regardless of ambient temperatures? My car runs between 240 and 250 no matter how cold it is outside.

Its a BMW, it can do anything it wants

[Park2670]

Originally Posted by White05X3

Moving away from price for a moment...

My other concern with this ad is that it does not really address whether or not the oil cooler solves the true problem. This car is not overheating during normal driving. It is not even having heat troubles during spirited street driving, especially when equipped with the factory oil cooler. Nor is the car running too hot (read inducing limp home mode) during hard street driving in really hot ambient temperatures.

Some people are overheating on the track (the ones where you turn the wheel sometimes). Dinan claims not to have tested their oil cooler at the track. Logically a larger, more efficient cooler SHOULD solve the problem. I am just disturbed that there is no data showing that their product actually solves the main problem.

On a side note...has anyone noticed that this car runs at whatever oil temperature it wants to, regardless of ambient temperatures? My car runs between 240 and 250 no matter how cold it is outside.

My car has never gone above 260 on the street, no matter how hard I drive. Its almost always at 240. The track is a different story. Anything above 90 F ambient temps the car eventually hits the limp mode.

Originally Posted by beepbeep

That's the oil thermostat and where BMW wants it to run. That keeps water and the resulting acids from building up in the oil.

Then why does Dinan say 240 is way too hot? BMW specifically made the cooler open up at 230. There has to be a reason for that. There is no way that the Dinan cooler makes the car run at ~210 if the thermostat isnt even open (its mechanical not electric).

Originally Posted by e46e92love

Its a BMW, it can do anything it wants

Quoted for truth

[beepbeep]

Originally Posted by Park2670

BMW specifically made the cooler open up at 230. There has to be a reason for that.

Quoted for truth

The other way to look at it though, is that BMW made the cooler close down at 230 (and below). There also has to be a good reason for closing the thermostat. For the usual driving conditions with BMW recommended oil, 230 is not "too hot". Also note that the engine boost is limited until the oil has warmed up to a specified temperature (170?) even though the block (water) temperature is above that. If temperatures below 230 were good for the oil and engine, BMW would have opened the thermostat sooner; after all they are warranting an expensive engine. Best.

[e46e92love]

Originally Posted by beepbeep

The other way to look at it though, is that BMW made the cooler close down at 230 (and below). There also has to be a good reason for closing the thermostat. For the usual driving conditions with BMW recommended oil, 230 is not "too hot". Also note that the engine boost is limited until the oil has warmed up to a specified temperature (170?) even though the block (water) temperature is above that. If temperatures below 230 were good for the oil and engine, BMW would have opened the thermostat sooner; after all they are warranting an expensive engine. Best.

Bingo, I remember reading an interview with the lead tech that was posted on here and about a dozen other sites stating that the high temps were necessary to keep emissions down (they need to run the car lean to get fuel economy up and certain emissions down, lean means warmer). So basically this car was designed to run hot. Now that design is fine for everyday use. But on the track that is when the car has issues, but BMW doesn't care about that because they didn't build it for the track, that what the M division is for.

[DrDomer]

Originally Posted by leftcoastman

reb03 tested it and found that for ATs, it's the water temp. Do a search and you can see his data logs. I believe he was hitting 40 degree higher temps on ATs vs. his MT.

Was the Bathurst car an AT? I thought it was MT. Also, I think they removed the AC condenser, which is the equivalent of making the radiator more efficient.

Thanks. I will be searching. The Bathurst car was a MT. I know not quite an apples to apples comparision. Obviously they felt it was necessary to run a larger oil cooler given more boost from the Procede even on a MT car.

Edit: I'm a dumarse... I actually posted in that thread... LOL. Yes my eyes have seen that data, unfortunately my brain forgot they did.

[radgator1]

Originally Posted by bronco

Potty - They laughed at me and my GROUP BUY suggestion....
I want to see how many people will actually buy the 2K oil cooler, and then I will gladly laugh at them for being stupid

This is ridiculous - This cooler pobably cost about $200.00...

See Orbs replies in this thread. It is not a 200.00 product or anywhere near that. More like 1400.00 but still significantly over priced.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by DrDomer

Water wetter +1

No Diesel Wetter! Water wetter has additives that chunks BMW coolant. Diesel Wetter - no additives

[Orb]

Originally Posted by T Bone

No Diesel Wetter! Water wetter has additives that chunks BMW coolant. Diesel Wetter - no additives

It will not chunk your system up but it would increase the possibility if you add hard water to the system. There are two chemicals in water wetter that can be corrosive to plastics but they are not found in most cooling systems. The diesel wetter is probably a safer beat if you already have 50/50 mixture and if you 30/70 mixture then water wetter would be better in this case as long as you use distilled water.