[Tr4ckD4ys]

Sooo… now that all the Alpina owners got their shot of $35k markup pride settled for larger turbos and a different factory ECU tune, returning to my original point:
- In everyday driving, 3.5s 0-60 (let’s be *very* optimistic here and say an XB7 can get there, alongside RS Q8s, Cayenne Turbos and some other SAVs/SUVs) and 4.0s (let’s be again *very* optimistic and say the X7 M50i, and a host of other SUVs/SAVs do it) is such a slim difference that:
A) you’re not gapping anybody before you have to take your foot of the gas due to traffic patterns
B) The timing of hitting that gas pedal matters much more than the additional 100hp or larger turbos or any of it

Therefore I conclude that most SAVs/SUVs in the 3.5s-4.5s range don’t give each other much in every day driving. Open interstate might be different - as would be 60-120mph. Even then though I think that it’s not a huge difference. Ie I tried some Shelby GT500s (760hp rwd supercharged) with my M4 Comp (measly 455hp at the time) and would be able to keep up reasonably well from 60-120. Obviously none of that on public roads and all within legal limits…

PS: I’m just messing with you Alpina folks. I love your cars.

[Al Pinã]

I paid the extra money because:

A) I have it to burn

B) These fuckers are rare. Way less than 1K total in the US

C) It's been a long standing dream to own one

D) It will absolutely and unequivocally decimate every other X7 (and 98% of all cars) on the planet in straight line performance and when the road gets twisty.

The silly conjecture you mention about traffic patterns and "whoever hits the gas first wins" is laughable to me. If you're feeling frisky bring that new M50i anywhere within 100 miles of Chicago and we'll race for titles. 0-60, 60-120, 0-whatever speed your limiter kicks in at.. You call it.

I'll be sure to bring my car trailer.

[Tr4ckD4ys]

Originally Posted by Al Pinã

I paid the extra money because:

A) I have it to burn

B) These fuckers are rare. Way less than 1K total in the US

C) It's been a long standing dream to own one

D) It will absolutely and unequivocally decimate every other X7 (and 98% of all cars) on the planet in straight line performance and when the road gets twisty.

The silly conjecture you mention about traffic patterns and "whoever hits the gas first wins" is laughable to me. If you're feeling frisky bring that new M50i anywhere within 100 miles of Chicago and we'll race for titles. 0-60, 60-120, 0-whatever speed your limiter kicks in at.. You call it.

I'll be sure to bring my car trailer.

All super valid reasons and don't get me wrong: I absolutely love the Alpinas. This wasn't directly about Alpinas and I did want to troll around a bit to make this thread a bit more interesting.

My original point however is: 100hp and 1sec difference on paper aside - How much does this really show in every day driving. Not just M50i vs XB7 but also versus Audi, Mercedes, Porsche, Lamborghini and some of the other higher end trims of higher end manufacturers. Beating a Jeep/Ram/Dodge is not the ball game we should be playing with these cars. Either way I'll be taking you up on the offer once I have hit that 1200mile mark... Or maybe, I'll see you on the Chicago streets before that...

[BigEvan1923]

Originally Posted by Tr4ckD4ys

All super valid reasons and don't get me wrong: I absolutely love the Alpinas. This wasn't directly about Alpinas and I did want to troll around a bit to make this thread a bit more interesting.

My original point however is: 100hp and 1sec difference on paper aside - How much does this really show in every day driving. Not just M50i vs XB7 but also versus Audi, Mercedes, Porsche, Lamborghini and some of the other higher end trims of higher end manufacturers. Beating a Jeep/Ram/Dodge is not the ball game we should be playing with these cars. Either way I'll be taking you up on the offer once I have hit that 1200mile mark... Or maybe, I'll see you on the Chicago streets before that...

I’ve had my M50i since July and I love it beyond anything else I’ve owned…but after having had the opportunity to drive the XB7 I’m sold on the Alpina. It’s everything you love about the M50i dialed in a few notches more. The suspension is better (and noticeable), the power delivery is better, the overall experience is better and of course, the exclusivity is a nice bonus. Whether it’s 35k better is entirely subjective but when you start to add it all up - it’s a compelling proposition. I will be looking for one, once my lease is up. My only wish is the inclusion of the alpina version of the m steering wheel from the B8, and the ability to shadowline the whole thing like in Europe. If I was being precious, I’d opt for the lavalina leather - but with two kids under 3, I’m not entirely masochistic.

[Tr4ckD4ys]

Originally Posted by BigEvan1923

I’ve had my M50i since July and I love it beyond anything else I’ve owned…but after having had the opportunity to drive the XB7 I’m sold on the Alpina. It’s everything you love about the M50i dialed in a few notches more. The suspension is better (and noticeable), the power delivery is better, the overall experience is better and of course, the exclusivity is a nice bonus. Whether it’s 35k better is entirely subjective but when you start to add it all up - it’s a compelling proposition. I will be looking for one, once my lease is up. My only wish is the inclusion of the alpina version of the m steering wheel from the B8, and the ability to shadowline the whole thing like in Europe. If I was being precious, I’d opt for the lavalina leather - but with two kids under 3, I’m not entirely masochistic.

You're not the first to say that - everybody tells this argument "The Alpina is just more refined in a noticeable way". I'm hoping once @Al Pina and I are meeting for the first recorded M50i vs XB7 0-60 runs, he'll let me drive his for a minute or two

[padrino]

I have the only XB7 in my neighborhood but there are a handful of M50i and X5M, the X5M owner knows how to get on it but have not seen any M50i owners that want to have that kind of fun..

Looking forward to hearing…

[superkala]

Nor-Cal- 62 Degrees Launch Control 3.53 Seconds- Also been to 168....Aint lost a stoplight/stop sign yet. Wifey won't let me drive it much anymore and it's only been 4 months....Everything you could ever want...ALPINA!

[Tr4ckD4ys]

Originally Posted by superkala

Nor-Cal- 62 Degrees Launch Control 3.53 Seconds- Also been to 168....Aint lost a stoplight/stop sign yet. Wifey won't let me drive it much anymore and it's only been 4 months....Everything you could ever want...ALPINA!

That is a good number. A great one really.

[itiongo]

Originally Posted by Tr4ckD4ys

All super valid reasons and don't get me wrong: I absolutely love the Alpinas. This wasn't directly about Alpinas and I did want to troll around a bit to make this thread a bit more interesting.

My original point however is: 100hp and 1sec difference on paper aside - How much does this really show in every day driving. Not just M50i vs XB7 but also versus Audi, Mercedes, Porsche, Lamborghini and some of the other higher end trims of higher end manufacturers. Beating a Jeep/Ram/Dodge is not the ball game we should be playing with these cars. Either way I'll be taking you up on the offer once I have hit that 1200mile mark... Or maybe, I'll see you on the Chicago streets before that...

I just recently traded my SQ7 for a X7 M50i, tested the Alpina too. My SQ7 was Stage 1 tuned. SQ7 and SQ8 Stage 1 tuned is no joke. I went from 500hp to 710hp and 568tq to 751tq, for only $1000. I'm 99% sure my M50i, even when stage 1 tuned, will not be able to catch the SQ7.

Here's video proof of the increase in power.

[Tr4ckD4ys]

Originally Posted by itiongo

I just recently traded my SQ7 for a X7 M50i, tested the Alpina too. My SQ7 was Stage 1 tuned. SQ7 and SQ8 Stage 1 tuned is no joke. I went from 500hp to 710hp and 568tq to 751tq, for only $1000. I'm 99% sure my M50i, even when stage 1 tuned, will not be able to catch the SQ7.

Here's video proof of the increase in power.

OK so, summarizing what you said:
- A Stage 1 tuned M50i will not beat a stage 1 tuned SQ7 (that would make sense, the SQ7 is lighter and the tune adds more power than the BMW tune)
- A base M50i will beat a base SQ7 (I'm adding this detail because that's where it stands)
- RS Q8 base is def faster than M50i base, about on par with XB7, however SQ8 base is slower than XB7 base
- Logically, a tuned SQ8 will beat a base XB7 but probably not a tuned XB7

Meh... again, I'm thinking that at 0.5-1s difference in those numbers, you are not significantly gapping anybody in everyday traffic. I might be wrong. There hasn't been enough anecdotal evidence, leave alone actual evidence.

[itiongo]

Originally Posted by Tr4ckD4ys

OK so, summarizing what you said:
- A Stage 1 tuned M50i will not beat a stage 1 tuned SQ7 (that would make sense, the SQ7 is lighter and the tune adds more power than the BMW tune)
- A base M50i will beat a base SQ7 (I'm adding this detail because that's where it stands)
- RS Q8 base is def faster than M50i base, about on par with XB7, however SQ8 base is slower than XB7 base
- Logically, a tuned SQ8 will beat a base XB7 but probably not a tuned XB7

Meh... again, I'm thinking that at 0.5-1s difference in those numbers, you are not significantly gapping anybody in everyday traffic. I might be wrong. There hasn't been enough anecdotal evidence, leave alone actual evidence.

The M50i and SQ7 at base, is pretty evenly matched, but according to car testers and official numbers, the SQ7 should be faster. At least for the 0-60 and the 1/4 mile. But, as you said, the real everyday traffic driving doesn't matter. This is the reason I ditched the SQ7. The M50i's tech and luxury is worlds apart, IMHO.

[Tr4ckD4ys]

Originally Posted by itiongo

The M50i and SQ7 at base, is pretty evenly matched, but according to car testers and official numbers, the SQ7 should be faster. At least for the 0-60 and the 1/4 mile. But, as you said, the real everyday traffic driving doesn't matter. This is the reason I ditched the SQ7. The M50i's tech and luxury is worlds apart, IMHO.

I mean the X7 is also longer, wider and higher and consequently a good chunk heavier than Q7/Q8 but also roomier.

Wasn't Audi gonna do a Q9?

[MystroX5]

Originally Posted by itiongo

I just recently traded my SQ7 for a X7 M50i, tested the Alpina too. My SQ7 was Stage 1 tuned. SQ7 and SQ8 Stage 1 tuned is no joke. I went from 500hp to 710hp and 568tq to 751tq, for only $1000. I'm 99% sure my M50i, even when stage 1 tuned, will not be able to catch the SQ7.

Here's video proof of the increase in power.

That video shows nothing about conditions and elevation of the road. Its done to sell a product and nothing more. They are showing you what they want to show you to sell a product. I have done several APR Stage 2 and Stage 3 in Audi's I have owned from RS4, S4, etc..over the last decade. APR tuning vastly varies in its results with the outside temp and elevation. I have seen this on the dyno as well with one great run and follow up runs that fall off significantly when mild heat becomes a factor.

[itiongo]

Originally Posted by MystroX5

That video shows nothing about conditions and elevation of the road. Its done to sell a product and nothing more. They are showing you what they want to show you to sell a product. I have done several APR Stage 2 and Stage 3 in Audi's I have owned from RS4, S4, etc..over the last decade. APR tuning vastly varies in its results with the outside temp and elevation. I have seen this on the dyno as well with one great run and follow up runs that fall off significantly when mild heat becomes a factor.

This is my SQ7, and my video. I recorded this on a back road. Not APR. I am from Wisconsin. There's a reason only the dashboard is shown. "None incriminating video". I do not have the dynamic handling package.

Here, is this "Good 3nough?" to prove to you that Stage 1 SQ7 is no joke? This is a "Sports differential" SQ7.

[superkala]

Aloha, since this is an X7 forum I can state that those Audi's are BUTT UGLY and anyone that tries to talk shit about the Alpina XB7 doesn't own one! Mahalo!

[NLRMS]

Originally Posted by Al Pinã

I paid the extra money because:

A) I have it to burn

B) These fuckers are rare. Way less than 1K total in the US

C) It's been a long standing dream to own one

D) It will absolutely and unequivocally decimate every other X7 (and 98% of all cars) on the planet in straight line performance and when the road gets twisty.

The silly conjecture you mention about traffic patterns and "whoever hits the gas first wins" is laughable to me. If you're feeling frisky bring that new M50i anywhere within 100 miles of Chicago and we'll race for titles. 0-60, 60-120, 0-whatever speed your limiter kicks in at.. You call it.

I'll be sure to bring my car trailer.

Well said about A) B) C) and D).

If you guys end up racing I might be available to come and serve as a witness

Many muscle or pure performance cars out there but none of them have the ability to deliver performance and comfort the way Alpina does.

[Al Pinã]

Originally Posted by superkala

Nor-Cal- 62 Degrees Launch Control 3.53 Seconds- Also been to 168....Aint lost a stoplight/stop sign yet. Wifey won't let me drive it much anymore and it's only been 4 months....Everything you could ever want...ALPINA!

Wow… even better than I suspected. I still haven't attempted a launch control blast as the roads are so fucked here I can't go 50ft without having to dodge a pothole. I did however hit 140 mph on a curving section of where LSD connects to I-55 by McCormick Center. The lateral grip is truly insane! I'm sure the doucher in the 2-Series that was trying to keep up with me thought the same thing. (Seriously, why is it always the bottom rung BMWs that want to test me?)

Heading over to rural western Illinois tomorrow so hopefully I find a nice stretch where I can scare the crap outta my wife a few times.

Knowing how conservative BMW/Alpina is with boost pressure, I'm sure there's another 100hp laying dormant in this motor. Reached out to DME and unfortunately they don't tune Alpina's.. :

[Jakerx]

Originally Posted by Al Pinã

Alpina uses larger turbos and forged pistons if I'm not mistaken so you won't be able to get that output from an M50i with just a tune.

Not sure exactly what type, but for sure the Alpina has different intercoolers, manifolds, pistons, and turbos.

[Tr4ckD4ys]

Originally Posted by JakerStyle

Not sure exactly what type, but for sure the Alpina has different intercoolers, manifolds, pistons, and turbos.

That is very comforting lol for M50i owners - sure can't compete with that... Who doesn't prefer mechanical HP over software HP.

[itiongo]

Darn, I forgot to mention the 5th step. Alpina, after we've raced for slips and I've won. I'll use the remaining $12,000 to buy some ammo. I've changed my mind about stripping your XB7. Instead, I'll take it to my wooded land and gun it down with $12,000 worth of ammo.

There, I spent $30,000 to out perform a stock Alpina XB7.

Yes, this would be a troll post.

edit: oh, looks like my post where I shared the process of how I would dust an XB7 was removed.

Here:
1. Pick a popular tune, like Eurocharged, which gives the M50i 680hp and 622tq.(Power output exceeds the XB7(in numbers)) $3000

2. Dyno and drag for real world results. $5000

3. NOS mod the M50i. $5000

4. Dyno, tune, and drag for for real world results. $5000

$18000 total to dust the XB7.

[itiongo]

Looks like I'm not the only ignorant fool who thinks a tuned M50i will match a stock XB7.

https://bit.ly/3sRs79e

[Tr4ckD4ys]

I dabbled a bit with launch control for the first time yesterday. I only did two attempts and the conditions weren't favorable, but I needed to just try it out.

My setup is a X7 M50i with the stock Bridgestone Alenza tires and no other modifications and about 2500 miles on it (I tend to drive a ton in the first few months of ownership - got the vehicle End of January). I used the BMW M Laptimer app for measurement.

Conditions were subpar, with about 39F outside temp, cloudy day, winter-dusty road (ie salt and dust). I also had just filled up the car on gas and had only driven about a mile from the gas station.

It took the vehicle 4.13 seconds from 0-60 under these conditions. This is actually not too bad and faster than my stock F82 M4 Comp. I think with some Pilot Sport 4S and better conditions, a 3.9-4.0 range is realistic. A JB4 map 2 will likely bring it down to 3.8-3.9, and a DMEtune to 3.5-3.6.