[Orient330iNYC]

Just for another (small) data point, my brother has bought out three of my leases over the years.
All have stuck to the factory oil change intervals and all have gone past 100k miles. Hes very much a do the recommended minimum car maint person.
The only car that had an engine issue was an e90 n52, but that was the defective valve cover bolts that broke, but not oil related.

I personally would probably stick with the factory intervals, but for the past few years all of my oil changes have been triggered by time vs use ( ive been averaging 5k miles a year), so im changing the oil every 5-6k miles anyway.

If you look at blackstone labs analysis of oil from the b58, it seems to indicate that rhe factory oil is perfectly capable of sustaining the 10k intervals, good amount of additives left, proper viscosity, etc, low wear metals, etc.

In the eu, the change intervals are much longer than in the us. And i dont believe they have free maintenance.

On the othet side, its cheap insurance, but im not convinced based on the blackstone tests ive seen that its necessary.

[Orient330iNYC]

Originally Posted by tatoweb

Just added to my post that I plan to keep this car for 5-6 years/100K-120K miles.

I can’t do it myself. For people using dealers, if you go in their website, many have “value service special” which is basically an oil and filter change for $100 (6 cylinders) and $130 (8 cyl). I don’t know why some people report here paying $300-$400 for an oil change.

For $100 makes sense to change oil every 5K miles. Will schedule “break in oil change” for next week.

If you looks closely at the fine print, the value oil changes are a service special only valid for certain cars.
https://bmwusaservice.com/valueservi...E&gclsrc=aw.ds

Very few cars under warranty are listed for the value services. Likely they use it as a loss leader to get people in the door to diagnose and repair more lucrative issues.

[chicagox7]

Historically, we’ve been a 1 x a year based on time people. Mainly because we rented cars for our long road trips. I was on the fence with our new X7 and got it changed at around 5k (think I even had a similar post with mixed feedback)
https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=30173798
Playing into that was we brought it in for a check engine light- so opted for an oil change since we were there. They only charged about $100 for the oil change. They didn’t reset the system- and we brought in at 8500 for the 1 year service. I suspect/hope we’ll be at 1x year on a go forward. That said, if it’s in the shop in 6 mos and we’ve put 5/6k on it- I may splurge the 100 for a change, since it’s there. Won’t go out of my way though.

Hearing the results of the oil analysis definitely helps me in that thinking.

[Orient330iNYC]

this has been a hot button topic for basically the entire time i've had a bmw, now 20+ years. across multiple engines, you will find tons of blackstone reports.
the general consensus ( i dont think ive ever seen a blackstone report that said the drain interval was too long, most of them have told the client that they can go longer, to 10K miles) has been that the 10K intervals are not exceeding the life of the oil.

the CBS countdown in our cars is not a straight 10K miles, it starts at 10K and counts down. not sure if its the same on the G series platform, but for many many years it was based on gallons of fuel consumed with adjustments made for cold starts, oil PH (theres is/was an oil quality sensor that measured acidity and some other factors). which makes sense, if you beat on your car, your fuel economy will drop, and you'll tick down the miles on the counter faster than if you are cruising highway miles all the time.

its cheap enough to just do it, especially if your dealer will do the change for the value price but IMHO its not necessary. reams of blackstone oil tests seem to indicate the factory oil is capable of enduring the factory oil change intervals.

[thenew3]

I've owned BMW's for 30 years now, always followed the on board computer recommendation for oil changes. My E46 sometimes went 18k miles between oil changes. Even at 18k miles, the blackstone lab reports came back saying the oil was good for continued use and there was minimal to no wear metals.
Never had issue with engine even at 175k miles when I sold it. (Would've kept it longer except we needed a bigger car for baby stuff).
You can't go wrong by following the mfg recommended service intervals.

[bimmerdiesel]

Echo Orient330iNYC

2/3 BMWs are post warranty 100k+miles and except for initial yrs, I stuck to what computer said. So far so good. Infact my diesel is closer to 150k. I have seen a lot of black stone reports and no report suggested doing early.

Due to multiple cars now yearly avg per car is down to 4-5k miles. My X7 got its first change at 3k and then 8k. So I think I m golden either ways.

[lloyd99]

I wrote this previously, but didn't get a response. I'll ask again... I have nearly zero mechanical knowledge myself. A good friend of mine is a 20+ year veteran auto mechanic. When I tell him I wait 10k miles for engine oil & filter changes in my X7, he typically gives me some grief. He says it’s not the degradation of the oil itself that is the issue. He says it’s the sludge that builds up and clogs oil passages for things like variable valve timing systems and variable lift systems (I may have his exact language wrong - I am going from memory). Does a sludge concern apply to a 2021 X7? I historically only keep my vehicles for 3 years and less than 50k miles - so engine life has never been an issue for me for the past 20 years or so. But I purchased my X7 as a CPO with 18k miles a little over a year ago, and I'm (currently) planning to keep it until the new 2027 model comes out. So I'm more interested in long-term care for this vehicle than my other prior vehicles. I'm fine paying for the extra oil changes, not trying to be too cheap. I'm just curious about the "sludge" topic.

[rjabend]

I have always believed in short 3 – 5K mile oil changes, but think I was dated due to advances in synthetic oils. I still like my 1st oil change to be at 1200 miles due to sludge buildup during initial break-in. My very experienced service provider recommends 10K miles after that when using the best synthetic oils and I suspect he is right. I was concerned about 0w - 12 and 0w – 20 use as BMW recommends, and he said that was to improve mileage due to lower oil pump effort. I am more concerned with proper lubrication and less engine wear than a miniscule increase in gas mileage and he confirmed the reduced wear benefits of using 10w – 30 synthetic, particularly in a warmer climate and I suspect 20w – 40 would be fine. To answer your question, I think a good oil filter should preclude the sludge build-up you are referring to. Another factor is driving type: stop and go versus highway or somewhere in between and whether trips are short not allowing engine warmup which could regulate change interval somewhat.
.

[Orient330iNYC]

Originally Posted by rjabend

I have always believed in short 3 – 5K mile oil changes, but think I was dated due to advances in synthetic oils. I still like my 1st oil change to be at 1200 miles due to sludge buildup during initial break-in. My very experienced service provider recommends 10K miles after that when using the best synthetic oils and I suspect he is right. I was concerned about 0w - 12 and 0w – 20 use as BMW recommends, and he said that was to improve mileage due to lower oil pump effort. I am more concerned with proper lubrication and less engine wear than a miniscule increase in gas mileage and he confirmed the reduced wear benefits of using 10w – 30 synthetic, particularly in a warmer climate and I suspect 20w – 40 would be fine. To answer your question, I think a good oil filter should preclude the sludge build-up you are referring to. Another factor is driving type: stop and go versus highway or somewhere in between and whether trips are short not allowing engine warmup which could regulate change interval somewhat.
.

There are blackstone reports for the bmw branded 0w20 (it seems to hold up much better than the liquidmoly 0w20) and those reports have said theres no concerns.
If you want to go with a heavier oil make sure you use a bmw ll01 or ll04 oil (i believe these are valid for the b58 in both lci and pre lci, but havent checked). And keep your reciepts. You dont want a warranty denial because you used an unapproved oil.

[rjabend]

Originally Posted by Orient330iNYC

There are blackstone reports for the bmw branded 0w20 (it seems to hold up much better than the liquidmoly 0w20) and those reports have said theres no concerns.
If you want to go with a heavier oil make sure you use a bmw ll01 or ll04 oil (i believe these are valid for the b58 in both lci and pre lci, but havent checked). And keep your reciepts. You dont want a warranty denial because you used an unapproved oil.

Good advice! Also note that the BMW manual states that 0w-20 is not suitable for some of their larger engines. Do you know why that is?

[Orient330iNYC]

Originally Posted by rjabend

Good advice! Also note that the BMW manual states that 0w-20 is not suitable for some of their larger engines. Do you know why that is?

different engines have different requirements. i know back in the day the M engines used a heavier weight, i think the current crop still uses 5W30 while the rest are doing 0w20.
the lci is using 0w12
and apparently this is a requirement for the new design of the TU2
see post 393
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/th...0#post-6755693

basically mess with your oil weight at your peril. if something big goes south they will analyze the oil. hell, in the early days of the hpfp failures, they would check the ethanol content of the fuel and deny if it was too high.

[Orient330iNYC]

Originally Posted by lloyd99

I wrote this previously, but didn't get a response. I'll ask again... I have nearly zero mechanical knowledge myself. A good friend of mine is a 20+ year veteran auto mechanic. When I tell him I wait 10k miles for engine oil & filter changes in my X7, he typically gives me some grief. He says it’s not the degradation of the oil itself that is the issue. He says it’s the sludge that builds up and clogs oil passages for things like variable valve timing systems and variable lift systems (I may have his exact language wrong - I am going from memory). Does a sludge concern apply to a 2021 X7? I historically only keep my vehicles for 3 years and less than 50k miles - so engine life has never been an issue for me for the past 20 years or so. But I purchased my X7 as a CPO with 18k miles a little over a year ago, and I'm (currently) planning to keep it until the new 2027 model comes out. So I'm more interested in long-term care for this vehicle than my other prior vehicles. I'm fine paying for the extra oil changes, not trying to be too cheap. I'm just curious about the "sludge" topic.

if the oil has been changed at least once a year with a bmw approved oil i wouldnt worry.

the horror stories of bmw engines sludging are usually from abuse, like not changing the oil ever during a 3 year lease, using non syn with an extended drain interval, etc.

typically sludge happens when the additive package gets depleted when the oil is "worn" out. then the oil oxidises and forms clumps.
from all the blackstone reports, with the normal OCIs, there is still sufficient active TBN (the additive package in a simplistic sense)

the other cause of sludge is water getting into the oil, either through a gasket leak (coolant) or lots of short trips that dont get the engine up to temp to boil off the water. thats part of the reason behind the at least 1 change per year.

[rjabend]

The AutoZone link below shows an objective explanation of what oil weight description parameters mean and where different weights are applicable. Very informative for me!

https://www.autozone.com/diy/motor-o...der%20climates.

Also: "So, since the difference between 5w20, 5w30, and 10w30 is the temperature at which they work best, the answer depends on where you live and what the climate is."

This forum facilitates education!

[rjabend]

Just thought I would add that my owner's manual calls out as suitable:
SAE 0W-12
SAE 0W-20.
SAE 0W-30.

I will probably go with 0W-30 since that satisfies the BMW requirements and warmer climates as well. The manual also flags the 12 & 20 as unsuitable for the larger engines likely due to the lower lubricity. Interestingly, under my hood it calls out 0W-12. I am also reading that BMW oil visicosity requirements change by country . . . not sure I understand that.

[Orient330iNYC]

Originally Posted by rjabend

Just thought I would add that my owner's manual calls out as suitable:
SAE 0W-12
SAE 0W-20.
SAE 0W-30.

I will probably go with 0W-30 since that satisfies the BMW requirements and warmer climates as well. The manual also flags the 12 & 20 as unsuitable for the larger engines likely due to the lower lubricity. Interestingly, under my hood it calls out 0W-12. I am also reading that BMW oil visicosity requirements change by country . . . not sure I understand that.

Note that not only the weight, but also it needs to be approved, i believe ll-01fe, ll-22.
.

[lloyd99]

Originally Posted by Orient330iNYC

if the oil has been changed at least once a year with a bmw approved oil i wouldnt worry.

the horror stories of bmw engines sludging are usually from abuse, like not changing the oil ever during a 3 year lease, using non syn with an extended drain interval, etc.

typically sludge happens when the additive package gets depleted when the oil is "worn" out. then the oil oxidises and forms clumps.
from all the blackstone reports, with the normal OCIs, there is still sufficient active TBN (the additive package in a simplistic sense)

the other cause of sludge is water getting into the oil, either through a gasket leak (coolant) or lots of short trips that dont get the engine up to temp to boil off the water. thats part of the reason behind the at least 1 change per year.

Thank you very much for the explanation. I appreciate it!

[rjabend]

Originally Posted by Orient330iNYC

Note that not only the weight, but also it needs to be approved, i believe ll-01fe, ll-22.
.

I believe you are correct.

From the Manual:
Suitable engine oil types
When topping up engine oil, the following oil
specification applies:
Gasoline engine
BMW Longlife-01 FE.
BMW Longlife-17 FE+.
BMW Longlife-22 FE++.

[RSouthern]

One option that I haven't seen raised here is getting an engine oil analysis done to find out how the oil you're using is holding up and then adjusting your service interval accordingly. This way you have data that shows your oil is still protecting the moving parts (or not).

I've been using Blackstone Labs for my analysis for at least the last 15 years (I have no affiliation with them just a happy customer), and when you send them your 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc samples from subsequent oil changes, they compare how much metal they detected (copper, iron, aluminum etc), the state of the additives and what the effective oil grade is at the time of the sample to your previous samples. It gives you the history and comparisons so you can make more informed decisions on extending your service interval, or shortening it. Super easy to do: You have your dealer do a clean "catch" of the oil when they drain it for a regular service. I've never had any pushback from them on this request (same from other dealers: Jeep, Buick, VW and Lotus), then put it in their special shipping container, fill in the form with payment info and drop it in the mail. Wait 2-3 weeks and they email you the results. They have pre-paid packages too.

Since so much about oil life and engine wear is dependent on the conditions you drive in and how you drive, I don't think there's a single answer that helps you preserve your money and your engine. The safe approach is frequent services, but you have the inconvenience of having to drive to the dealer (1 hour each way for me) and spend more money on gas (extra driving time) and on unnecessary/early oil changes. Get your oil tested and follow their guidance to know more.

[rjabend]

Originally Posted by RSouthern

One option that I haven't seen raised here is getting an engine oil analysis done to find out how the oil you're using is holding up and then adjusting your service interval accordingly. This way you have data that shows your oil is still protecting the moving parts (or not).

I've been using Blackstone Labs for my analysis for at least the last 15 years (I have no affiliation with them just a happy customer), and when you send them your 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc samples from subsequent oil changes, they compare how much metal they detected (copper, iron, aluminum etc), the state of the additives and what the effective oil grade is at the time of the sample to your previous samples. It gives you the history and comparisons so you can make more informed decisions on extending your service interval, or shortening it. Super easy to do: You have your dealer do a clean "catch" of the oil when they drain it for a regular service. I've never had any pushback from them on this request (same from other dealers: Jeep, Buick, VW and Lotus), then put it in their special shipping container, fill in the form with payment info and drop it in the mail. Wait 2-3 weeks and they email you the results. They have pre-paid packages too.

Since so much about oil life and engine wear is dependent on the conditions you drive in and how you drive, I don't think there's a single answer that helps you preserve your money and your engine. The safe approach is frequent services, but you have the inconvenience of having to drive to the dealer (1 hour each way for me) and spend more money on gas (extra driving time) and on unnecessary/early oil changes. Get your oil tested and follow their guidance to know more.

Many Variables . . . excellent analytical suggestion!