[bono]

So you decline to spend additional $15k to have a faster vehicle and then you buy M3 for....(not sure what these cars cost) to drive off from red light a bit faster than M60i a few times per year? Unless you track your M3, then indeed you are not a poser.

Originally Posted by wtwo3

Surprised this thread is still going on.

A lot of interesting theories about why people opt for the 40i over the m60i. I think many fail to consider that this may not be the only car in the garage. Literally the only time I drive the X7 is either when I'm with my family, or if i ever need to transport something large or take it in for service. So I have absolutely no desire to pay an extra $15k (regardless of what % I get back in resale - it won't be 100% of that upcharge), when I can't use the extra power. My wife especially doesn't appreciate spirited driving, so instead I go for the smoothness of the 40i.

For all my fun and spirited driving, I'd never pick an SUV to begin with. And so for that purpose I take my m340i and soon to be delivered M3. So I'd essentially be burning $15k to get the m60i where I wouldn't be able to use that power anyway. And it doesn't really offer any other benefits aside from power. My 40i I was able to order with DHP and IAS, so I'd argue my 40i is actually nimbler to drive than the equivalent m60i due to the weight savings - should I choose to take a sharp turn or two in the rare situation that I'm driving a large 3 row SUV solo.

Now if this was my only vehicle and I had a family to transport from time to time, then sure I'd get the m60i.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by bono

So you decline to spend additional $15k to have a faster vehicle and then you buy M3 for....(not sure what these cars cost) to drive off from red light a bit faster than M60i a few times per year? Unless you track your M3, then indeed you are not a poser.

My M3 is a 6mt and rwd. I have no interest in going marginally quicker from a red light - if I did, then I'd have opted for an EV (or at least the automatic M3 comp xdrive). I like the engagement the manual provides along with the nimbleness of the M3 while still being practical enough to easily drop off/pick up the kids from school.

[bimmerdiesel]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

I would also say just because I think that way doesn't mean I don't enjoy driving my 40i. I just enjoy it in a different way. It's remarkably luxurious, so I enjoy the serene driving experience it offers vs my daily, an m340i. But if I want a spirited driving experience, I'm not taking the large 5,500 lb 3 row SUV.

Fully acknowledge and agree as I have been there. I used to think the same way that who needs a large suv for spirited driving but now I do. And v8 also offers serene driving experience that you get in I6. I sometimes forget that I m driving a big suv

[Saejin]

Not sure the upcharge from 40i to 60i is exactly $15K if doing apples to apples comparison.

The M60i gets you DHP and IAS, plus 22” wheels are included.

On the 40i, if BMW ever brings it back the IAS is/was $1150, DHP is/was $3300, and opting for 22” wheels is $1300.

So, the difference is more or less around $9k-$10k, but I haven’t done an exact build to build comparison.

For some, spending the extra $13k or so is worth it for the engine, DHP, and IAS.

[bono]

Your money, your preferences. Other people may apply different logic. Therefore, people in Europe buy 5 series wagon to tow a trailer, bring Christmas tree, drop off kids to school and to commute to work. In the US many would claim that you need at least 3 different cars for such tasks.

Originally Posted by wtwo3

My M3 is a 6mt and rwd. I have no interest in going marginally quicker from a red light - if I did, then I'd have opted for an EV (or at least the automatic M3 comp xdrive). I like the engagement the manual provides along with the nimbleness of the M3 while still being practical enough to easily drop off/pick up the kids from school.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by Saejin

Not sure the upcharge from 40i to 60i is exactly $15K if doing apples to apples comparison.

The M60i gets you DHP and IAS, plus 22” wheels are included.

On the 40i, if BMW ever brings it back the IAS is/was $1150, DHP is/was $3300, and opting for 22” wheels is $1300.

So, the difference is more or less around $9k-$10k, but I haven’t done an exact build to build comparison.

For some, spending the extra $13k or so is worth it for the engine, DHP, and IAS.

I have DHP and IAS on my 40i. When I was doing the comparison back in July I believe it was coming in somewhere between that $13k-$15k. But that's besides the point. I just didn't feel the upcharge for the m60i was worth it for my use case. I'm not sure when I'd use the extra power. If I'm driving solo I'm taking the sports sedan which does "sport" better. If I'm driving with family, then I'm not driving spirited anyway.

I'm not knocking anyone for opting for the m60i. I'm simply responding to those knocking us who opted for the 40i.

[Herofmine]

My choice was X7 40i, because this will be mostly driven by my wife taking kids to school. Because we already have x5m, if you have only one car for fun and daily use then get m60i. Otherwise I dont see much point of getting V8 family car.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by bono

Your money, your preferences. Other people may apply different logic. Therefore, people in Europe buy 5 series wagon to tow a trailer, bring Christmas tree, drop off kids to school and to commute to work. In the US many would claim that you need at least 3 different cars for such tasks.

Right... my money, my preferences. I'm not knocking anyone for opting for the m60i. I'm responding to those who are knocking us who opted for the 40i, and am offering a perspective on why the 40i makes more sense for me. If this was my only vehicle, I myself would have opted for the m60i. But as we need 2 vehicles, I have the opportunity to split duties. The m3 does "sport" and driving engagement better and the X7 does does luxury and practicality better, so I'm playing to those strengths in my choices.

But glad to know you think non-tracking M3 owners are posers because all we ever care about is who's faster in a straight line from a red light

[BMW5and7]

From nearly most responses, if M60i/50i comes at the same exact price-tag as the 40i, most (again, not all) would take the M60i. As I can see, the most common response is that the additional $10K doesn't worth the extra power, hence I understand that the reason is a financial-decision than anything else for some. The M60/50i has more to offer if price difference is taken out of the equation, but whether its worth it or not is a subjective topic that also depends on your financials.

I've never ever used the M50i to it's max (i.e.: I rarely push the gas pedal to the "max" and never did a 0-60 race from a red light), and I don't think that's the main reason most of 50/60i chose the 50/60i. It is the drive spirit and the superior feeling of the extra HP and toque on highways or even in-town. it does worth every singe penny though again I never use it to race around. V8 engines are always unique to drive, especially when most of your other vehicles are V8s too, you don't want to feel a that your ~$100K X7 is a downgrade as a car enthusiast. Price difference and $ are subjective stuff, however, even if the entire vehicle depreciates by 40-50% after a typical 4-5 years of ownership, the 10K portion for 50/60i equates to $4-5K total or 83 bucks per month (100% worth it for me). This is all based on the worst-case scenario or assumption that 50/60i depreciates as fast as 40i, though I still believe 50/60i gets much better trade in offers or less depreciation %s than 40i (especially if the vehicle is fully loaded as in most cases anyway for 50/60i's). When I did the math, the $10K MSRP difference depreciates by ~$4,500 "loss" after trading-in, which equates to 75 bucks a month after 5-years @ 40-50% depreciation. Costs me less than a single Chick-Fil-A visit per month for a family of 5 nowadays ($10K * (50-40)% / 5years / 12 month = 75 bucks). If you buy pre-owned vehicles, the decision is much easier then.

[MystroX5]

Originally Posted by Herofmine

My choice was X7 40i, because this will be mostly driven by my wife taking kids to school. Because we already have x5m, if you have only one car for fun and daily use then get m60i. Otherwise I dont see much point of getting V8 family car.

The most obvious reason one would only consider a V8TT is because all your other cars are fast and powerful and that is the standard you are use to and can afford to own.
The idea of compromising with any vehicle in the fleet, especially a $100k+ luxury vehicle is unacceptable. This is a matter how serious a car enthusiast is and maybe where they are in life.
If you desire a large powerful full size luxury vehicle, your options are limited with the push to smaller engine sizes. Now might be the time to get a muscle engine while you still can.


On a side note: Merry Christmas to a great G07 forum. We may disagree at times but we still are friendly and a great source of information and help. Keeping our side of the forum classy.

[Saejin]

Originally Posted by bono

Your money, your preferences. Other people may apply different logic. Therefore, people in Europe buy 5 series wagon to tow a trailer, bring Christmas tree, drop off kids to school and to commute to work. In the US many would claim that you need at least 3 different cars for such tasks.

I’m sure many here would take a real close look at the 5-series wagon, but we don’t represent the majority of the US market. Audi brought over the RS6 Avant, but not the A6/S6 Avant which would have been slightly more affordable. Not sure the reasoning here except maybe Audi thought there was a market for the RS6 and not the S6…more of a wealthy enthusiast market I guess as the RS6 runs near $120k+ and only seats 5. So pretty impractical for the price range when for that money you could easily step into X7, GLS, and other 7-seater lux cars.

[Saejin]

Originally Posted by BMW5and7

From nearly most responses, if M60i/50i comes at the same exact price-tag as the 40i, most (again, not all) would take the M60i. As I can see, the most common response is that the additional $10K doesn't worth the extra power, hence I understand that the reason is a financial-decision than anything else for some. The M60/50i has more to offer if price difference is taken out of the equation, but whether its worth it or not is a subjective topic that also depends on your financials.

I've never ever used the M50i to it's max (i.e.: I rarely push the gas pedal to the "max" and never did a 0-60 race from a red light), and I don't think that's the main reason most of 50/60i chose the 50/60i. It is the drive spirit and the superior feeling of the extra HP and toque on highways or even in-town. it does worth every singe penny though again I never use it to race around. V8 engines are always unique to drive, especially when most of your other vehicles are V8s too, you don't want to feel a that your ~$100K X7 is a downgrade as a car enthusiast. Price difference and $ are subjective stuff, however, even if the entire vehicle depreciates by 40-50% after a typical 4-5 years of ownership, the 10K portion for 50/60i equates to $4-5K total or 83 bucks per month (100% worth it for me). This is all based on the worst-case scenario or assumption that 50/60i depreciates as fast as 40i, though I still believe 50/60i gets much better trade in offers or less depreciation %s than 40i (especially if the vehicle is fully loaded as in most cases anyway for 50/60i's). When I did the math, the $10K MSRP difference depreciates by ~$4,500 "loss" after trading-in, which equates to 75 bucks a month after 5-years @ 40-50% depreciation. Costs me less than a single Chick-Fil-A visit per month for a family of 5 nowadays ($10K * (50-40)% / 5years / 12 month = 75 bucks). If you buy pre-owned vehicles, the decision is much easier then.

TL;DR…just kidding.

My main take-away here…skip chick-fil-a once a month and take home a brand new BMW X7 M60i.

Which is very true. Life is about trade offs for most.

[BMW5and7]

Originally Posted by Saejin

TL;DR…just kidding.

My main take-away here…skip chick-fil-a once a month and take home a brand new BMW X7 M60i.

Which is very true. Life is about trade offs for most.

Sometimes that's all what it takes, lol.

[bono]

Americans preferred SUVs over station wagons a long time before SUVs became popular worldwide. On top of that you have the "right tool for job" mentality in the US and therefore in the US only trucks can tow, you need M3 to drive fast (with common speed limits around 65 mpg) plus you need a family hauler, e.g. Tahoe, or whatever the US big SUV are. There is no space for station wagon in an average US family.

Originally Posted by Saejin

I’m sure many here would take a real close look at the 5-series wagon, but we don’t represent the majority of the US market. Audi brought over the RS6 Avant, but not the A6/S6 Avant which would have been slightly more affordable. Not sure the reasoning here except maybe Audi thought there was a market for the RS6 and not the S6…more of a wealthy enthusiast market I guess as the RS6 runs near $120k+ and only seats 5. So pretty impractical for the price range when for that money you could easily step into X7, GLS, and other 7-seater lux cars.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by Saejin

TL;DR…just kidding.

My main take-away here…skip chick-fil-a once a month and take home a brand new BMW X7 M60i.

Which is very true. Life is about trade offs for most.

I skip Chick-fil-A every Sunday... I think that qualifies me for an XB7

[BMWFantastic85]

Originally Posted by BMWFantastic85

I'm still on the fence of getting an X7, but did get a chance to test drive both the 40i and M60i during the same afternoon. Based on my short sampling, I actually agree that the 40i feels smoother off the line and on local streets. I'm presently pricing both out, still favoring the M60i.

I'm capitulating. 40i it is.

Reasons:

(1) I have two young boys and at least once a week, drive around my MIL, so at least for the foreseeable future, I am more focused on comfort and luxury rather than spirited driving.

(2) I also have a dog I like to take around on drives and family trips so between the dog and my two young boys, there could be some material wear-tear (probably unlikely but you never know). I'll feel more comfortable if they beat up a vehicle that's 85K vs 108K.

(3) I've mentioned in another thread that I was afraid to trade up to the X7, after having driven an X1, X3, X5, Acura MDX, Audi A4, because I could probably never go back to driving any of the aforementioned and that there wouldn't be too many cars to look forward to as someone who's around 40 years old. Well, you better believe the next car to trade up after the 40i will be the M60i.

(4) The biggest reason is the 20K plus price difference, I'll be honest, not ready!

[Saejin]

Originally Posted by BMWFantastic85

I'm capitulating. 40i it is.

Reasons:

(1) I have two young boys and at least once a week, drive around my MIL, so at least for the foreseeable future, I am more focused on comfort and luxury rather than spirited driving.

(2) I also have a dog I like to take around on drives and family trips so between the dog and my two young boys, there could be some material wear-tear (probably unlikely but you never know). I'll feel more comfortable if they beat up a vehicle that's 85K vs 108K.

(3) I've mentioned in another thread that I was afraid to trade up to the X7, after having driven an X1, X3, X5, Acura MDX, Audi A4, because I could probably never go back to driving any of the aforementioned and that there wouldn't be too many cars to look forward to as someone who's around 40 years old. Well, you better believe the next car to trade up after the 40i will be the M60i.

(4) The biggest reason is the 20K plus price difference, I'll be honest, not ready!

You’re spot on it will be hard to go back to the other vehicles you mentioned. They’ll make great second cars, but for your primary people, dog, and MIL mover, it’ll be the X7 or something comparable. I stepped back earlier this year from a fully loaded X7 M50i to a fully loaded SQ5. Lasted 11 months before I was back in an X7 M60i.

You mention $23k upcharge to jump into an M60i, but that would be if you stuck with almost no options on the 40i. As a standard build it almost doesn’t need any, but there are some that just make sense and needed on a vehicle of this class.
The gap between the both with similar options is still around $10K so it’s a step up for sure.

If you’re already thinking of the M60i done the road, might be a good time to really work the numbers now for a couple of reasons. One, it’s not going to get cheaper. Two, full redesign is coming in 4 or so years and who knows what’s up BMWs sleeve. And three, there may not be a V8TT in the next X7 given the move to EVs and great restrictions on smog for vehicles in the future…I’m only guessing on this one, but other manufacturers with V8s are starting to phase them out.

[patrikr]

Originally Posted by MystroX5

The most obvious reason one would only consider a V8TT is because all your other cars are fast and powerful and that is the standard you are use to and can afford to own.
The idea of compromising with any vehicle in the fleet, especially a $100k+ luxury vehicle is unacceptable. This is a matter how serious a car enthusiast is and maybe where they are in life.
If you desire a large powerful full size luxury vehicle, your options are limited with the push to smaller engine sizes. Now might be the time to get a muscle engine while you still can.

This comment is exactly how I feel and the reason I’m looking at a M60i to replace my M50i X5. Our other car is a Model X and all cars I’ve had in the last 15 years have been pretty powerful.

[NGT2]

It seems like some of the V8 drivers in this thread get more defensive than the 40i drivers. I feel like both sides have been well laid out in several posts.

I don’t think people saying “I don’t see the point in performance in my family car” mean any judgement on those that feel compelled to max out performance in every car. I certainly don’t have any judgement. But I’m perfectly happy to buy my wife a X7 40i while I’m always looking for the right M550 to trade my 540 for. I’m struggling to see why some argue this position. Fine to have a different position for oneself but it seems a logical one for others to have.

Live and let live. But the one that checks your boxes. You won’t be disappointed if you get what you want. Outside of money, there’s no need to justify your desire. These are BMWs. By nature, we’re talking about luxury spending, not practical spending. If you want it and the money isn’t a problem, then it will probably be worth it. If you are fine with a smaller powertrain and won’t regret it, then the extra expense probably isn’t worth it. Easy equation, really.

[Missduvy]

Originally Posted by Herofmine

My choice was X7 40i, because this will be mostly driven by my wife taking kids to school. Because we already have x5m, if you have only one car for fun and daily use then get m60i. Otherwise I dont see much point of getting V8 family car.

I have a V8 because I only have one car, and I miss my pre-kid fast AMG sedan. Some moms enjoy spirited driving too. My husband has 3 very fast cars, so when he has to drive the family mobile, he at least has one that’s reasonably enjoyable for him.

[pgk500]

[QUOTE=Angelo1;29618215]LMAO! You’re joking right? You are literally saving roughy 2-3mpg. Have you done the math on 50i vs. 40i fuel cost over a year? I have and it’s well under $1k. Even if it cost $1500 more in fuel, its pennies compared to the cost of these suvs. If you can afford a $75k suv, you won’t miss an extra 500-1k. Lol! You’re already buying premium fuel, might as well be for a V8. I owned an X7 40i and also drove a m50i for a week as a Turo rental. The very thing I noticed was 3mpg on highway difference and in town “Denver” it might have been 3-4mpg difference and that’s 4000 ft higher then where i live. I kept track of this because I am seriously considering buying a m50i and wanted to rent one before buying. Now I realize how boring and under power the 40i is for the X7 when loaded up. The 40i in the X5 is perfect but not when you load up an X7. The M50i just pulls so well on steep hill climbs and it feels much more alive on a regular driving basis. It’s still quiet when you want it to be and roars when needed. The M50i is only a gas guzzler if you’re constantly smashing the pedal otherwise it’s a very economical V8 compared to most V8 on the market for the amount of power it produces. [/

. V8 is good no doubt but I don’t need it for daily driving. I am very content with 40i . If you can’t be happy with 400hp Suv I don’t know what else will make u happy lol. Also, I am 87 octane/regular gasoline type of guy. Never felt any difference in my previous cars.

[NGT2]

Took the 40i on a road trip to see family for the holidays. Loaded down, got about 22 mpg averaging 70-75. So, really not that great. Just FYI.