[Wild Blue]

Originally Posted by Nantucket

You obviously do not own a cottage where you need to haul a huge amount of cargo sometimes.I have owned a Mercedes GL for the last 10 years and have had the 2nd and 3rd row bench seats folded flat countless times with a fully loaded truck.Its why you need a huge SUV.

Sure, I agree that some people will have a regular need to haul a lot of cargo, and would prefer to get a jumbo luxury SUV instead of a truck to do so. That fits many people's needs. However, (and without any empirical evidence to back up my supposition) I don't think that will be the majority of X7 buyers.

[Influence]

I've now sat in both the 2nd row captain's chairs as well as the bench seat. While I'll give the overall edge in comfort/luxury to the captain's chairs, the bench seat is surprisingly comfortable. Combined with their ability to fold flat and the on-seat tethering for car seats, if we get an X7 I'll be going with the 2nd row bench. You get an extra seat out of it too which could come in handy on occasion. I also don't like the cupholder thing on the floor when you get the captain's chairs - too easy to trip over it. Plus if is pretty hard (if not impossible, especially for an adult) to squeeze between the captain's chairs to get into the third row. That is probably the biggest reason to put captain's chairs in the second row - so that you can easily get into the 3rd row without having to fold/move the 2nd row seats.

[toddwalton]

Originally Posted by Influence

I've now sat in both the 2nd row captain's chairs as well as the bench seat. While I'll give the overall edge in comfort/luxury to the captain's chairs, the bench seat is surprisingly comfortable. Combined with their ability to fold flat and the on-seat tethering for car seats, if we get an X7 I'll be going with the 2nd row bench. You get an extra seat out of it too which could come in handy on occasion. I also don't like the cupholder thing on the floor when you get the captain's chairs - too easy to trip over it. Plus if is pretty hard (if not impossible, especially for an adult) to squeeze between the captain's chairs to get into the third row. That is probably the biggest reason to put captain's chairs in the second row - so that you can easily get into the 3rd row without having to fold/move the 2nd row seats.

There is one more benefit of the Captain’s Seat that I don’t think gets enough mention and that’s the avoidance of Bench Seat Claustrophobia.

We have a lived with the third row seat in our X5 for three years now and while we only use it situationally and it definitely comes in handy, the bench seat in front makes it a very isolated experience in cramped quarters and has made my kids carsick. Combination of the proximity of the bench to their faces and because they cannot see out of the windshield in the front of the car.

The gap between the Captain’s is going to give them better situational awareness and make them feel a lot better back there. We are giving up the 7th seat specifically for this reason.

[swenzi]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

There is one more benefit of the Captain’s Seat that I don’t think gets enough mention and that’s the avoidance of Bench Seat Claustrophobia.

We have a lived with the third row seat in our X5 for three years now and while we only use it situationally and it definitely comes in handy, the bench seat in front makes it a very isolated experience in cramped quarters and has made my kids carsick. Combination of the proximity of the bench to their faces and because they cannot see out of the windshield in the front of the car.

The gap between the Captain’s is going to give them better situational awareness and make them feel a lot better back there. We are giving up the 7th seat specifically for this reason.

Great point. Although I think the center seat back of the bench seat do fold down as a armrest?

[toddwalton]

Originally Posted by swenzi

Great point. Although I think the center seat back of the bench seat do fold down as a armrest?

It does, but the only time we’ve used the third row in our X5 is when the bench is full so the middle armrest doesn’t get put down and the kids in the third row can’t see the windshield and get claustrophobic and/or carsick.

If this is your first experience with BMW X third row, know that the center spot on the bench seat will always be preferred to one of the rear seats as it’s a pain to get the seats up (dad) and get back there (kids). But going Captain’s changes that because of the pass thru for ease of entry back there (kids) without a seat drop (dad) and offering forward visibility (kids).

That’s my real-world experience the last 3 years with the X5. And that’s why Captain’s are a godsend if you can live without the 7th seat. It’s a bigger deal and decision than you think.

[ppagiga]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

There is one more benefit of the Captain’s Seat that I don’t think gets enough mention and that’s the avoidance of Bench Seat Claustrophobia.

We have a lived with the third row seat in our X5 for three years now and while we only use it situationally and it definitely comes in handy, the bench seat in front makes it a very isolated experience in cramped quarters and has made my kids carsick. Combination of the proximity of the bench to their faces and because they cannot see out of the windshield in the front of the car.

The gap between the Captain’s is going to give them better situational awareness and make them feel a lot better back there. We are giving up the 7th seat specifically for this reason.

The claustrophobia benefit was something I immediately noticed. Really opens things up back there to have that space between the captains. Not to mention you can stretch your feet out a bit in that space.

Plus, the seat backs of the captain are sculpted, vs the flat carpeted seat backs of the bench. Not a huge deal but I personally prefer the former. Total consistency in fit, finish and materials from front to back of the vehicle

[760Lifan]

Originally Posted by ppagiga

Plus, the seat backs of the captain are sculpted, vs the flat carpeted seat backs of the bench. Not a huge deal but I personally prefer the former. Total consistency in fit, finish and materials from front to back of the vehicle

Just be careful what you put in the trunk.

The nice the sculpted backs are, the ugly they get once scratched..

[ppagiga]

Originally Posted by 760Lifan

Just be careful what you put in the trunk.

The nice the sculpted backs are, the ugly they get once scratched..

Good point. Demands extra caution

[Jarecki]

Are the armrest in the captain's chairs removable? I know they fold down, but can you take them out entirely?

[ppagiga]

Originally Posted by Jarecki

Are the armrest in the captain's chairs removable? I know they fold down, but can you take them out entirely?

2 or three of the pre production test reviews had communicated that yes they were removable. That was in May of last year. The reviews of last week made no mention of whether they can or can’t be removed.

BMW USA told me they “are not meant to be removed.” Whatever that means.

Hopefully a resourceful third party figured this out. I’ve yet to check out a parts diagram of that assembly but plan to

[bjcarls]

Captains chairs = luxurious Bench = utilitarian

In a BMW way

[Wild Blue]

Originally Posted by 760Lifan

The way the second row captain's fold, you also have to be very careful that you don't scratch the back of the seats when you have the third row folded flat. This MIGHT be an issue depending on what you transport in the trunk.

I remember an image of the third row folded with the captain's chairs plastic rears exposed. Keep in mind that you don't have that traditional "trunk barrier' anymore with the captain's. You have plastic covers left and right with a hole in the middle. No closed, protected barrier...

You do have the ability to put up the cargo net, either to hold things down to the trunk floor, or behind the seats as a protective barrier as you desire.


.

[Ilyam5]

Are the seats taller in the Captain chair config vs Bench? looks like they are on pedestal.

Bench folds flat into big trunk so it is lower even though it still has to move and has electronics under it.

[MystroX5]

I demoed a fully loaded X7 50i with 2nd row captain. It was beautiful except one inexcusable sin. The black plastic 2nd row cup holders on the floor looked and felt ridiculously cheap. It was so out of character with everything else in the entire vehicle it made no senses. It took up a unusual amount of floor space for just two cup holders that it looked like it was hiding something in the floor.
If I was getting a X7, it would have to be with the 2nd row bench to eliminate it.

[masmole]

Originally Posted by Ilyam5

Are the seats taller in the Captain chair config vs Bench? looks like they are on pedestal.

Bench folds flat into big trunk so it is lower even though it still has to move and has electronics under it.

I didn’t actually measure with a ruler but based on my recent experience comparing two show room floor X7s, one with captains chairs, one with bench, to me the captain’s chairs definitely felt more perched up higher. Also in the most rearward setting, the bench seemed to offer just a bit more 2nd row legroom. Captains chairs were definitely more comfortable, but not by much; bench seats hold their own in the comfort department. I’m still torn. If the captains chairs offered more amenities like seat ventilation and massage, it would more of a no-brainer. But since it doesn’t, I think I’ll go with the bench seats.

[justcurious321]

From what I have seen, the chairs look very similar in all the reviews... thankfully has settled some of the disappointment of having no captains chairs options (yet). Additional comfort may be due to the fact that captains chairs are more roomy although bench with the middle armrest or seatback down doesn’t seem so bad.

[toddwalton]

I'm happy to report that the Captain's Chair armrests are removable. Even better, putting the flat cover back on the seats covers up 95% of the opening except for a small hole for which the bolt customarily goes through. No knees will be scraped. No one will notice.

This is extra-important because today I also found out that when the 2nd row seat moves forward to allow a passenger into the 3rd row, the 2nd row seat doesn't remember its prior position. So imagine the chaos when the 15 year old brother sitting in the 2nd row has to keep moving his seat forward to provide decent legroom for the 12 year old sister behind him. Over and over again. 10x a day. He's getting bored of the repetition. She's getting angry for having to ask him. By removing the armrests and letting her glide between the seats, problem solved.

Many Bothans died to bring us this information.

[ppagiga]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

I'm happy to report that the Captain's Chair armrests are removable. Even better, putting the flat cover back on the seats covers up 95% of the opening except for a small hole for which the bolt customarily goes through. No knees will be scraped. No one will notice.

This is extra-important because today I also found out that when the 2nd row seat moves forward to allow a passenger into the 3rd row, the 2nd row seat doesn't remember its prior position. So imagine the chaos when the 15 year old brother sitting in the 2nd row has to keep moving his seat forward to provide decent legroom for the 12 year old sister behind him. Over and over again. 10x a day. He's getting bored of the repetition. She's getting angry for having to ask him. By removing the armrests and letting her glide between the seats, problem solved.

Many Bothans died to bring us this information.

lol ty for that info. re children seating positions, see if you can have them be happy in "standard" seating position. that position is easy to return to by just pushing a button.

process for removing arm rest doesnt look too bad. i'm not going to be the first to try this, though. not that brave

need someone to make some rubber stopper to cover that opening up.

[PIPE_DR]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

[IMG]https://i.postimg.cc/Cxq4n9Cg/IMG-3739.jpg[/IMG]

I'm happy to report that the Captain's Chair armrests are removable. Even better, putting the flat cover back on the seats covers up 95% of the opening except for a small hole for which the bolt customarily goes through. No knees will be scraped. No one will notice.

This is extra-important because today I also found out that when the 2nd row seat moves forward to allow a passenger into the 3rd row, the 2nd row seat doesn't remember its prior position. So imagine the chaos when the 15 year old brother sitting in the 2nd row has to keep moving his seat forward to provide decent legroom for the 12 year old sister behind him. Over and over again. 10x a day. He's getting bored of the repetition. She's getting angry for having to ask him. By removing the armrests and letting her glide between the seats, problem solved.

Many Bothans died to bring us this information.

I'm trying this asap, do you have anymore info? Where'd you find this?

[toddwalton]

Originally Posted by PIPE_DR

I'm trying this asap, do you have anymore info? Where'd you find this?

I visited a local dealership and explained that the only way I could order an X7 was if the armrests were removable. And I mean that. The way the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd rows interact with each other is a borderline train-wreck or, at the very least, a major inconvenience. Having my youngest two kids glide gracefully between the two Captain's to get the third row is actually the only solution for me and a lot of people. Who in the 2nd row and, unbelievably, the 1st row wants to get out of the car every time a 3rd row passenger jumps out when being dropped off? BMW didn't design the fully automated seats with passenger convenience in mind. It looks like they didn't realize they weren't designing an SUV but rather the world's coolest minivan.

Upon explaining my dilemma and scenarios to the salesperson, he said he'd talk to service and get back to me. Two hours later he said he and his service department did a lot of research and looked at all the schematics and found the answer to the two questions I had posed:

1. Can the armrests be removed?
2. If so, would any bolts be sticking out defeating the purpose?

That screencap is from a service computer which shows shop techs how to repair vehicles for which they have limited experience.

[toddwalton]

Originally Posted by ppagiga

lol ty for that info. re children seating positions, see if you can have them be happy in "standard" seating position. that position is easy to return to by just pushing a button.

Yeah, the Genius said the same thing to me. But that 2nd row 'standard' position is practically fully rearward meaning that it takes away all that extra legroom for the 3rd row that so many of us are excited about. When I sat back there today and let the 2nd row settle to the 'standard' setting it practically took my ankles out, it's just as bad as my X5 with the 3rd row. It may be a dirty little X7 secret, but the 2nd row passengers have to sacrifice about 4" of legroom to make the 3rd row passengers happy. Otherwise, it's an X5 third row all over again.

Originally Posted by ppagiga

process for removing arm rest doesnt look too bad. i'm not going to be the first to try this, though. not that brave

I'm going to have it done by the dealer before taking delivery. This way my kids will never know they were supposed to have armrests and they won't be disappointed that they are gone. They're used to a bench with the center armrest always in the 'up' position. So they're used to keeping their hands on their laps anyway.

Originally Posted by ppagiga

need someone to make some rubber stopper to cover that opening up.

Nah, no one will have an angle to see the little metal screw socket in there, it'll just look like black plastic. Just have the armrests removed and don't look back.

The shame of it all is that BMW was this close to finally giving the public the perfect luxury minivan replacement. All they had to do was give up the armrests and this bad ballet of 2nd row and 1st row seats inconveniencing passengers could have been completely avoided.

Next project? Getting that plastic floor tray out of there so my kids don't trip over it getting through the Captain's to the 3rd row.

[SW19]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

Yeah, the Genius said the same thing to me. But that 2nd row 'standard' position is practically fully rearward meaning that it takes away all that extra legroom for the 3rd row that so many of us are excited about. When I sat back there today and let the 2nd row settle to the 'standard' setting it practically took my ankles out, it's just as bad as my X5 with the 3rd row. It may be a dirty little X7 secret, but the 2nd row passengers have to sacrifice about 4" of legroom to make the 3rd row passengers happy. Otherwise, it's an X5 third row all over again.



I'm going to have it done by the dealer before taking delivery. This way my kids will never know they were supposed to have armrests and they won't be disappointed that they are gone. They're used to a bench with the center armrest always in the 'up' position. So they're used to keeping their hands on their laps anyway.



Nah, no one will have an angle to see the little metal screw socket in there, it'll just look like black plastic. Just have the armrests removed and don't look back.

The shame of it all is that BMW was this close to finally giving the public the perfect luxury minivan replacement. All they had to do was give up the armrests and this bad ballet of 2nd row and 1st row seats inconveniencing passengers could have been completely avoided.

Next project? Getting that plastic floor tray out of there so my kids don't trip over it getting through the Captain's to the 3rd row.

Why don’t you just wait for the MY20 GLS.The order guide shows that it will also finally have capatain’s chairs and the interior will definitely be larger than the X7.Maybe it will have a better design in the second row and have more room between the captain’s chairs.It is going to be shown for the first time at the New York City Auto Show this month.