[sahajesh]

First it was JLR starting the trend of a car subscription plan (although knowing JLR reliability and to paraphrase Patek Philippe, you don't own a JLR anyway, you just look after it in between garage services).

Now Volvo have started one fully, with a decent range of cars and unlike JLR, they are not base models and can be customised. JLR also charges a "membership fee", reinforcing the tosser image they have.

I may try an XC60 for a few months

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by sahajesh

First it was JLR starting the trend of a car subscription plan (although knowing JLR reliability and to paraphrase Patek Philippe, you don't own a JLR anyway, you just look after it in between garage services).

Now Volvo have started one fully, with a decent range of cars and unlike JLR, they are not base models and can be customised. JLR also charges a "membership fee", reinforcing the tosser image they have.

I may try an XC60 for a few months

JLR aren’t base models when I looked into it.

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

And don’t be fooled by the Volvo one, it’s not as good as it looks and not as good as the JLR model.

Volvo doesn’t include insurance after first 30 days, JLR does

With Volvo you have to give 3 months notice to stop, after first 3 months JLR is 14 days notice

Volvo only includes 6,000 miles per annum, JLR standard is 18,000 miles per annum

With Volvo you have to build your car or choose a stock car, options all increase the base price. JLR is just one price and you get what they have, which could be higher

Wouldn’t touch the Volvo subscription offer with a barge pole

[sahajesh]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

And don't be fooled by the Volvo one, it's not as good as it looks and not as good as the JLR model.

Volvo doesn't include insurance after first 30 days, JLR does

With Volvo you have to give 3 months notice to stop, after first 3 months JLR is 14 days notice

Volvo only includes 6,000 miles per annum, JLR standard is 18,000 miles per annum

With Volvo you have to build your car or choose a stock car, options all increase the base price. JLR is just one price and you get what they have, which could be higher

Wouldn't touch the Volvo subscription offer with a barge pole

I was able to increase the mileage on the Volvo one, there was a slider.

Care was relaunched a week or so ago so you may have seen the old one.

You are right about insurance, it's an extra cost whether it's through Care or off your own back.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by sahajesh

I was able to increase the mileage on the Volvo one, there was a slider.

Care was relaunched a week or so ago so you may have seen the old one.

You are right about insurance, it's an extra cost whether it's through Care or off your own back.

809 quid a month. You are joking.....??

[sahajesh]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

809 quid a month. You are joking.....??

And without insurance yes and of course no deposit to help out.

I still want an X5 anyway

[Watsey]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

809 quid a month. You are joking.....??

My thoughts exactly. It includes servicing and tyres, for example, but even so...!!

Looking at the Volvo example there's no way I'd go down a subscriptions route - the charges are too opaque.

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by sahajesh

I was able to increase the mileage on the Volvo one, there was a slider.

Care was relaunched a week or so ago so you may have seen the old one.

You are right about insurance, it's an extra cost whether it's through Care or off your own back.

I saw that too, the mileage slider, but obviously it increases costs.

There are less hidden charges in the JLR model it seems to me.

I think it’s £750 for an F Pace or Discovery Sport, including insurance and 1500 miles a month.

Assuming you need those miles it makes better sense.

All in cost £750 a month.

PCP monthly cost or lease for a middle of the range F Pace at 18,000 miles per annum approx £575 a month with no deposit.

Insurance for me with those miles including business about £50 a month.

Tax assuming list over £40k is about £40 a month.

Maintenance assuming 1 service a year approx £35 a month.

Tyres accrual, assuming changed every 2 years say £20 a month.

Total cost for comparison - £720 a month.

Doesn’t seem bad to me, an extra £30 for almost total flexibility after first 3 months.

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Not being able to put in a deposit to reduce monthly costs is not a reason not to do it in my view. It’s just a psychological trick.

Say you would normally put in £5k to reduce your costs by £125 ish a month. Just put that £5k in another bank account and transfer £125 a month into the account that you make your payments from. Same difference, that’s all the finance company really does in a round about way.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

Not being able to put in a deposit to reduce monthly costs is not a reason not to do it in my view. It’s just a psychological trick.

Say you would normally put in £5k to reduce your costs by £125 ish a month. Just put that £5k in another bank account and transfer £125 a month into the account that you make your payments from. Same difference, that’s all the finance company really does in a round about way.

Lets not start that one again!

I am out of PCP for now, decided I can borrow enough to buy a decent car with a small deposit that isnt earmarked for anything else, and buy it outright over 4 years. That way if my mileage changes or anything I am flexible, and hopefully at the end of 4 years it will be worth something.

Its what I used to do and I am trying to work out why I changed (apart from the lure of a shiny very expensive new toy...)

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

Lets not start that one again!

I am out of PCP for now, decided I can borrow enough to buy a decent car with a small deposit that isnt earmarked for anything else, and buy it outright over 4 years. That way if my mileage changes or anything I am flexible, and hopefully at the end of 4 years it will be worth something.

Its what I used to do and I am trying to work out why I changed (apart from the lure of a shiny very expensive new toy...)

Oh go on, let’s start it again.

How is putting £5k in another account and transferring it to your current account any different to putting it into the car? Marginal on interest maybe?

I’m not suggesting doing it every time for others, even though that’s how I personally view it.

All I meant was that in the car subscriptions model where you are not allowed to do it, don’t let it put you off, this is a perfectly valid way to overcome that obstacle.

I used to do it your way as well, but the wife has better uses for the money now. However, this is a discussion on car subscriptions, so as you say, maybe leave it here.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

Oh go on, let’s start it again.

How is putting £5k in another account and transferring it to your current account any different to putting it into the car? Marginal on interest maybe?

I’m not suggesting doing it every time for others, even though that’s how I personally view it.

All I meant was that in the car subscriptions model where you are not allowed to do it, don’t let it put you off, this is a perfectly valid way to overcome that obstacle.

I used to do it your way as well, but the wife has better uses for the money now. However, this is a discussion on car subscriptions, so as you say, maybe leave it here.

Indeed, 6 and 2 3s as my old gran used to say, personal preference and a bit of interest...not worth a debate

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

Indeed, 6 and 2 3s as my old gran used to say, personal preference and a bit of interest...not worth a debate

I wasn’t starting one.

In this thread for the purposes of car subscriptions you can’t put in a deposit, so no debate to be had. I was suggesting a solution to the psychological issue of the payments being too high, when on some of the schemes, they’re not that much different as a whole cost.

[TouringPleb]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

And don't be fooled by the Volvo one, it's not as good as it looks and not as good as the JLR model.

Volvo doesn't include insurance after first 30 days, JLR does

With Volvo you have to give 3 months notice to stop, after first 3 months JLR is 14 days notice

Volvo only includes 6,000 miles per annum, JLR standard is 18,000 miles per annum

With Volvo you have to build your car or choose a stock car, options all increase the base price. JLR is just one price and you get what they have, which could be higher

Wouldn't touch the Volvo subscription offer with a barge pole

What spec level do you get with the JLR deal?

I've looked and it didn't say.

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by TouringPleb

What spec level do you get with the JLR deal?

I've looked and it didn't say.

It says they’re all Premium spec and less than two years old. It also says as a minimum that they’ll have heated leather, sat nav etc.

I’m guessing most will be pretty good spec as they’re trying to keep you either through this or a more permanent deal. Not in their interest to screw you over.

Who knows, there might be one or two really highly specced rejected cars in the fleet. Doesn’t matter if it’s not yours.

Pretty disappointed in the Volvo offer. They’ve been talking about it for ages and then the baseline costs are almost on a par, but then extras, like reasonable miles or options, or it insurance, bump it right up. I think they’ll struggle.

[TouringPleb]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

It says they're all Premium spec and less than two years old. It also says as a minimum that they'll have heated leather, sat nav etc.

I'm guessing most will be pretty good spec as they're trying to keep you either through this or a more permanent deal. Not in their interest to screw you over.

Who knows, there might be one or two really highly specced rejected cars in the fleet. Doesn't matter if it's not yours.

Pretty disappointed in the Volvo offer. They've been talking about it for ages and then the baseline costs are almost on a par, but then extras, like reasonable miles or options, or it insurance, bump it right up. I think they'll struggle.

I didn't realise you could get a used car with the JLR service.

Seems a lot to pay for something that could be 24 months old.

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by TouringPleb

I didn't realise you could get a used car with the JLR service.

Seems a lot to pay for something that could be 24 months old.

Seems fair to me. If I get a car on a 4 year pcp at a similar, slightly lower cost, it’s average age is 2 years old. But not much flexibility.

For this, if they’re up to a max of 2 years old the average will be 1 year old.

As you can stop, start, swap for bigger and get them all at short notice, I think it would be unrealistic to expect a brand new car each time.

Again, this in my mind is better than the Volvo one, where there are a few cars in stock that take 30 days to get, and the rest you have to wait for a factory order. Seems counter intuitive to the whole easy breezy car subscription model.

[sahajesh]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

Seems fair to me. If I get a car on a 4 year pcp at a similar, slightly lower cost, it's average age is 2 years old. But not much flexibility.

For this, if they're up to a max of 2 years old the average will be 1 year old.

As you can stop, start, swap for bigger and get them all at short notice, I think it would be unrealistic to expect a brand new car each time.

Again, this in my mind is better than the Volvo one, where there are a few cars in stock that take 30 days to get, and the rest you have to wait for a factory order. Seems counter intuitive to the whole easy breezy car subscription model.

The upside of the Volvo model is that you do get a new car that you can spec (to an extent) whereas JLR is ready-specced - you may get a really good model with extra kit, but then you may not.

If the additional customisation is worth the extra, then the Volvo offer *may* be worth it.

As you say though, the JLR offer is far cheaper, but you'd want to know the minimum expected spec first.

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by sahajesh

The upside of the Volvo model is that you do get a new car that you can spec (to an extent) whereas JLR is ready-specced - you may get a really good model with extra kit, but then you may not.

If the additional customisation is worth the extra, then the Volvo offer *may* be worth it.

As you say though, the JLR offer is far cheaper, but you'd want to know the minimum expected spec first.

They tell you the minimum. It just might not be up to your minimum I suppose.

For me JLR have got it right. Customising your order to the nth degree doesn’t spring to mind on a subscription model that is designed to be switched on and off. It also includes everything, so no hidden charges, which again is attractive.

I don’t get the Volvo one. Customise yes, but not with the same base price as the JLR. A Momentum XC60, bottom of the range, with a few options and decent miles, suddenly goes well north of £800, with no insurance. And then 3 months notice to return. Oh, and waiting ages at the start too.

It doesn’t make as much sense to me as the JLR one, where there is genuinely more flexibility.