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      03-19-2023, 09:03 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by brinkmann View Post
You know where I can get a new X5M for $60k?
On the used market
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      03-19-2023, 09:04 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by SoCali E36 View Post
On the used market
New cars on the used market? Tell me more!
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      03-19-2023, 09:05 PM   #69
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New card on the used market? Tell me more!
Didn’t see the new part in your comment. But you sure can find a used one for that price 😉
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      03-19-2023, 11:38 PM   #70
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I think it would be more interesting if BMW launched the "Label Red" car with 750 hp and sent that out for review instead of this version with 650 hp.
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      03-20-2023, 12:43 AM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brinkmann View Post
New cars on the used market? Tell me more!
Now, that made me laugh 😂
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      03-20-2023, 04:29 AM   #72
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I was at the unveiling event last year here in Australia. When they unveiled the car, there was absolute silence in the crowd for about 30 secs. Presenter should have left it at that and moved on but, he can't, can he?

He asks - Well, what do you guys think?
One guy answered : We are still thinking...
Crowd: Burst out in laughter. (It was super funny because of the way he said it and the timing)
Embarrassing..

But, its a radical try and looked huge and techy. This generation's kids may like it and force their rich parents to buy one, who knows!
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      03-20-2023, 05:44 AM   #73
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It feels like it's the last days of a company (M division) desperately churning out cr8p to stay relevant when they release cars like this.

I know it's not and BMW are doing fine thanks but still has that smell about it.
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      03-20-2023, 08:42 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls View Post
XM = eXperiment for M.

Feels like the XM is just a textbook exercise for things to come for BMW M as they begin to move toward hybridization and electrification.

Reviews read like BMW executed well on each aspect but failed to tie it all together as a singular vehicle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls View Post
Not going to lie though, I am far more intrigued in the XM than the G Wagen and if I had to pick at gun point, I would pick the XM. I will probably get flamed for this but the G Wagen does absolutely nothing for me.
Agree on both fronts. I think BMW needed somewhere to beta test the M hybrid setup, and the XM is serving that purpose just like the i3 did with BEV. The G Wagen also does absolutely nothing for me, I will never understand the fascination with them.
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      03-20-2023, 08:52 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjae1976 View Post
The M division is gone down hill quickly.

First, I can’t believe BMW claims anything on the car claims to be an homage to the M1. The BMW and M divisions are so focused on the past they aren’t paying attention to the here and now.

So now M has nothing to do with motorsports. It should be the ///D division for drag racing. No one really cares what a drag racing car looks like which seems to be the approach in designing the recent M models.

///M = comfortable, high tech and luxury drag racing.

Somehow Porsche continues to elevate their performance, M keeps moving further from if.

This hybrid V8 should have been released ages ago.

This split headlight design has to go.

BMW builds composite monocoques. Why doesn’t BMW build an M car with one?

An M3 - carbon monocoque and body panels, take all of the crap out of it, weighs 3k lbs, and put in a turbo hybrid 4 with a MGU-K. I’d pay $100k for that!

Or imagine if M cars had carbon monocoques? Then you wouldn’t need 100 adjustments to the car and +50lbs of bracing. BMW doesn’t interest me anymore. I’ve sat in and driven every current M
car. Not one has moved me. It’s fun in a straight line. I get in an E60 M5…it’s like HOLY F%#?!!!

I get the the feeling the XM will be even more underwhelming.
To be fair, certain recent BMW models have come with excellent chassis. The G8x, the IX come to mind.

Even the G2x based endurance race cars are a huge step forward compared to previous generations. We may not like the looks, but the performance is there.

It is true that Porsche made even bigger leaps in performance in this timeframe, but their cars have also become unobtainable.

I’m certainly giving the new M2 a big consideration, and as much test driving as possible.
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      03-20-2023, 02:13 PM   #76
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I kept seeing reviews pop up and all of them share the same sentiment, not good. The only review I read that painted it in a positive light is from The Drive. Seems like the interior quality is a miss for what you’re paying for and it’s competitors do a better job with the performance/comfort mix.
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      03-20-2023, 02:16 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by Mingwan View Post
Not sure which review to watch. I just know that I won’t be watching the Straight Pipes one because of the stupid ass the-world-is-ending face in the thumbnail. It’s about as cringey as the side trim accent on the XM.
I used to like their reviews but they keep doing these horrible “influencer” thumbnails. Will be staying away just like I do from huge grill BMWs.
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      03-20-2023, 02:32 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brinkmann View Post
You know where I can get a new X5M for $60k?
He's in Canada. the XM's based price is 275k CAD with taxes (including 22k for the new luxury tax in Canada). That's a full 200k USD!

A 2023 X5M is 178k with taxes. The new 2024 is probably 10k more, but 100k isn't that far off...
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      03-20-2023, 03:40 PM   #79
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The XM will sell great, because they only make a few of them. Delivery date for new orders in Germany are already late 24. like many wrote, this car is made for a different customer and BMW does really well financially. The targeted customers won’t care about the mentioned things. I’m driving a pre-LCI X7 and love it so far. I thought about switching to an XM a 100 times? The Pro / Cons list is very balanced between both cars. If there were a PHEV X7, I would prefer it over the XM. The XM is just not special enough for this price.

What nobody talks about is the potential of the S68 in combination with the electric powertrain. So for me, a young 2nd hand XM with upgraded turbos and the ability to drive silent a few KM, is still a charming idea.
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      03-20-2023, 06:43 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maltman View Post
The XM will sell great, because they only make a few of them. Delivery date for new orders in Germany are already late 24. like many wrote, this car is made for a different customer and BMW does really well financially. The targeted customers won’t care about the mentioned things. I’m driving a pre-LCI X7 and love it so far. I thought about switching to an XM a 100 times? The Pro / Cons list is very balanced between both cars. If there were a PHEV X7, I would prefer it over the XM. The XM is just not special enough for this price.

What nobody talks about is the potential of the S68 in combination with the electric powertrain. So for me, a young 2nd hand XM with upgraded turbos and the ability to drive silent a few KM, is still a charming idea.
There’s no doing upgraded turbos on the s68 unless it has forged internals coming from the s63. Would love to know if this new v8 has changed that or still kept them the same weak rods from s63tu4 carried over from f90.
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      03-20-2023, 07:24 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SatinblkF90 View Post
There’s no doing upgraded turbos on the s68 unless it has forged internals coming from the s63. Would love to know if this new v8 has changed that or still kept them the same weak rods from s63tu4 carried over from f90.
That’s okay. But even a stage 2 tune will change the vehicles character.
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      03-20-2023, 08:29 PM   #82
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It's very gaudy and extremely overpriced especially since it has exactly the same interior buttons, controls, displays and trim of an X5 and also the V8 of the same X5 as the basis for it's engine. We will get used to it's looks but its value will always be highly questionable.
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      03-21-2023, 12:06 AM   #83
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Its stunning. The customers BMW is targeting with the XM will buy all of them and not think twice about the price. Everyone else will not fully understand it, but will be in awe when one drives by.

This car is for bold trailblazers. Not people dithering over value or practicality.
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      03-21-2023, 06:14 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hufington View Post
It's very gaudy and extremely overpriced especially since it has exactly the same interior buttons, controls, displays and trim of an X5 and also the V8 of the same X5 as the basis for it's engine. We will get used to it's looks but its value will always be highly questionable.
Exactly! If this supposed to be a new concept to show the new direction BMW wants to go, then it should offer something new all around and not look like it was put together using whatever they already had in the parts inventory. Especially for the price!
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      03-21-2023, 08:32 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carnook View Post
Its stunning. The customers BMW is targeting with the XM will buy all of them and not think twice about the price. Everyone else will not fully understand it, but will be in awe when one drives by.

This car is for bold trailblazers. Not people dithering over value or practicality.
No one is arguing over value, the fact remains that BMW is charging way too much for the XM. I always laugh when the implication is made that the people talking about not liking a particular vehicle it is because they cannot afford it. I easily could, have zero desire to do so, it is unattractive then add to that the power and handling that full M vehicles are known for, just isn't there.
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      03-21-2023, 10:52 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TXSchnee View Post
No one is arguing over value, the fact remains that BMW is charging way too much for the XM. I always laugh when the implication is made that the people talking about not liking a particular vehicle it is because they cannot afford it. I easily could, have zero desire to do so, it is unattractive then add to that the power and handling that full M vehicles are known for, just isn't there.
What should it have cost?

Just as an example, a Cayenne Turbo S E-Hybrid Coupe starts at $173,800 and while a bit quicker, is smaller and shares a substantial many more parts with a base Cayenne. And out the door you’re easily looking at $20k+ more than a fully loaded XM.

I think they’re spot on with the price. It’s a bit tough in the current market having to pay MSRP but 2 years ago you’d easily have gotten $9k off. Interest rates aren’t helping the situation either.

I’d like it to be cheaper of course, but BMW put it at a level that undercuts most of the competition by a considerable amount and it’ll bring new folks to the brand. I know my college-age son loves it. They’re going to make more money on people like him over his lifetime than they will people like me who have probably bought more BMWs previously than I will in the future.

It’s a smart business move, even if it alienates some existing customers. It’s what luxury brands do to survive and stay relevant.
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      03-21-2023, 11:54 AM   #87
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What should it have cost?

Just as an example, a Cayenne Turbo S E-Hybrid Coupe starts at $173,800 and while a bit quicker, is smaller and shares a substantial many more parts with a base Cayenne. And out the door you’re easily looking at $20k+ more than a fully loaded XM.

I think they’re spot on with the price. It’s a bit tough in the current market having to pay MSRP but 2 years ago you’d easily have gotten $9k off. Interest rates aren’t helping the situation either.

I’d like it to be cheaper of course, but BMW put it at a level that undercuts most of the competition by a considerable amount and it’ll bring new folks to the brand. I know my college-age son loves it. They’re going to make more money on people like him over his lifetime than they will people like me who have probably bought more BMWs previously than I will in the future.

It’s a smart business move, even if it alienates some existing customers. It’s what luxury brands do to survive and stay relevant.
It should have started at $130,000, slightly undercutting the Alpina XB7. There is nothing on this vehicle that is special to merit the $160,000 start, and a Cayenne Turbo S E Hybrid doesn't share much with a base Cayenne (for starters all the performance bits, leather, and other things are standard). I have a Cayenne E Hybrid (the V6 one) and it is just as fast as the XM, possibly quicker. My Taycan 4S Cross Turismo is definitely quicker, and my previous iX M60, at $120k blows the XM out of the water (with Air Suspension as standard). BMW has never really charged much for their vehicles, compared to the German competition, and they are attemtping to place themselves in a range that offers much better vehicles that are more bespoke.
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      03-21-2023, 12:27 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TXSchnee View Post
It should have started at $130,000, slightly undercutting the Alpina XB7. There is nothing on this vehicle that is special to merit the $160,000 start, and a Cayenne Turbo S E Hybrid doesn't share much with a base Cayenne (for starters all the performance bits, leather, and other things are standard). I have a Cayenne E Hybrid (the V6 one) and it is just as fast as the XM, possibly quicker. My Taycan 4S Cross Turismo is definitely quicker, and my previous iX M60, at $120k blows the XM out of the water (with Air Suspension as standard). BMW has never really charged much for their vehicles, compared to the German competition, and they are attemtping to place themselves in a range that offers much better vehicles that are more bespoke.
Wow, that's $15k less than the starting point on the XB7's $145k starting point.

I have an XB7 and it's incredible, but it's not a huge departure from the X7 M60i. Exhaust, brakes, increased turbos and then some brand bits are the major difference. You're also bit paying for the exclusivity.

The XM makes the pre-LCI XB7 look old. And it outperforms an XB7 while also being able to be 100% electric while bouncing around town with the kids.

Out the door it's actually not much different than an XB7 when you look at the actual cost of ownership. You pretty much have to buy the XB7 as the residuals on a lease are horrible. A dealership with an XM in stock said that for 36 months, with 10k miles the residual for an XM is 54%. That's better than an XB7 enough that out the door, if you lease, the price difference all but disappears.

And I'd disagree with your comment on the Cayennes not sharing much with each trim. Your average person cannot tell each trim from one another. No one will confuse an XM for any other BMW which is what they are going for.
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