[Archie007]

Been watching the market for a while now looking for the right opportunity/options. Looking nationwide.

Recently saw a 2021 with every option that we were looking for. Was on the lot for 60 days but was overpriced at 75k. Brought the comps, used KBB but couldn't get the dealership to go below 73k. It sold 2 cars later.

Came across a 2020 a few weeks later that has all the options, including night vision and ambient air. Also listed almost 8k above KBB.

Despite that, I'm thinking even if I get this a few thousand off ask, it's still saving me 8-12k off a 21 or 22.

Wondering how you would think about this? Overpay for a 2020 or pay more real dollars for a 21 that's "fairly" priced. How much weight do you assign to KBB?

[Tr4ckD4ys]

I would not assign that much weight to KBB at all. The prices you are mentioning are in range. I.e. It’s unlikely a dealer will sell you at KBB price.

In the case of pre-LCI X7, I would also not assign too much weight to the model year. I would simply go based on mileage and the options you’re looking for!

[keg97]

Isn't it more important what the "real" market is rather than an assigned market like KBB? You've been shopping cars and know the market and pricing better than a computer model run program like KBB. Plus you know better what's right and what's important to you. A couple of grand over the long term in the 70-80K range is just not worth it. Consider your time and effort in all of this as well!

[Archie007]

Originally Posted by Tr4ckD4ys

I would not assign that much weight to KBB at all. The prices you are mentioning are in range. I.e. It’s unlikely a dealer will sell you at KBB price.

In the case of pre-LCI X7, I would also not assign too much weight to the model year. I would simply go based on mileage and the options you’re looking for!

Thanks. I guess I've just been seeing way more 21s and have attempted to negotiate a couple so I feel like I have a good sense of where they should be. Market for 20s with 30k miles isn't very large, probably only like 10 cars in the country so wasn't really sure how else to think about price. So you'd say mid-low 60s is in range for a well optioned 2020?

[Archie007]

Originally Posted by keg97

Isn't it more important what the "real" market is rather than an assigned market like KBB? You've been shopping cars and know the market and pricing better than a computer model run program like KBB. Plus you know better what's right and what's important to you. A couple of grand over the long term in the 70-80K range is just not worth it. Consider your time and effort in all of this as well!

Ya, you're absolutely right. I was kicking myself for not just being more aggressive on the last negotiation and just paying the couple grand over. Thank you for the advice!

[keg97]

Originally Posted by Archie007

Ya, you're absolutely right. I was kicking myself for not just being more aggressive on the last negotiation and just paying the couple grand over. Thank you for the advice!

Live and learn! Plus I'm always going glass half full that there is something better waiting for me.

Keep us posted and good luck!

[tkelley86]

I would beat these guys up a couple grand and snag this one. It's CPO'd and has basically every option available minus crazy leather packages:

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=375178019

[tkelley86]

Here's an even better list, these were the ones I was keeping an eye on. They all have DHP and B&W. Most if not all have all the other expected options (cold weather, executive, extended leather, luxury seating, etc.):

High mileage but cheap and loaded
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=364912529

Loaded with bench seat (brown):
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=355082027

Southern owned, white, a bit pricey for a 2020 but hey...
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=368907777

Tarfufo! Killer interior, great history and southern owned, no upgraded driver assist (who cares...)
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=365850210

Not the best history but loaded
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=375105851

CPO, this one is kind of a safe bet and priced right, plus you can get a great APR through BMW financing
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=375178019

[Archie007]

Originally Posted by tkelley86

Here's an even better list, these were the ones I was keeping an eye on. They all have DHP and B&W. Most if not all have all the other expected options (cold weather, executive, extended leather, luxury seating, etc.):

High mileage but cheap and loaded
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=364912529

Loaded with bench seat (brown):
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=355082027

Southern owned, white, a bit pricey for a 2020 but hey...
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=368907777

Tarfufo! Killer interior, great history and southern owned, no upgraded driver assist (who cares...)
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=365850210

Not the best history but loaded
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=375105851

CPO, this one is kind of a safe bet and priced right, plus you can get a great APR through BMW financing
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=375178019

Wow than you so much for this.
Interesting that you pointed out the white 2020 at 62k being a bit pricey. I do love the white.

The one I'm looking at is priced at 65k with 31k miles. Tanzebite with ivory/blue interior. Makes me think it's way overpriced based on some the listings you suggested.

Is Southern owned something you look for and value more?

[keg97]

Southern owned infers it hasn't been exposed to winter snow and salt. But these things are family trucksters and could easily be used for ski trips. That wouldn't drive my decision making.

[tkelley86]

Originally Posted by Archie007

Wow than you so much for this.
Interesting that you pointed out the white 2020 at 62k being a bit pricey. I do love the white.

The one I'm looking at is priced at 65k with 31k miles. Tanzebite with ivory/blue interior. Makes me think it's way overpriced based on some the listings you suggested.

Is Southern owned something you look for and value more?

I'm honestly on the fence about the southern owned. I just see people always reference it and talk about it as a positive. I would feel more comfortable with a car that grew up away from winters but when you're shopping cars that are only 3-4 years old, does it matter? Especially with today's manufacturing standards? Hopefully someone smarter than me will chime in on this topic. To me, it's just a bonus but not a must have.

If the car you are referencing above is a 2021, then it's priced about right. If it's a 2020, it's 3-5k over market. I'm seeing whacky stuff with X7's pricing across the US but the bottom line is this, there are tons priced wrong (high) and they aren't moving (100+ days at a dealer). Especially in this market where used cars are highly sought-after. X7's for whatever reason seem to be somewhat insulated from what's happening across the industry (i.e. they're not holding there value as much as say a GLS580).

[keg97]

Originally Posted by tkelley86

I'm honestly on the fence about the southern owned. I just see people always reference it and talk about it as a positive. I would feel more comfortable with a car that grew up away from winters but when you're shopping cars that are only 3-4 years old, does it matter? Especially with today's manufacturing standards? Hopefully someone smarter than me will chime in on this topic. To me, it's just a bonus but not a must have.
.

Exactly my thoughts!

[Tinbad]

I’d pick a 2020 with the right options any day over a 1 or 2 MY newer, especially at a discount. Pocket the difference and save for a rainy day/out of warranty repair. Ambient air and Night vision is something you can’t get beyond 2020. In the long term the “resale” difference on a 2020 or 2021 will be negligible. If anything the fully loaded one will likely be worth a bit more.

[Archie007]

Originally Posted by Tinbad

I’d pick a 2020 with the right options any day over a 1 or 2 MY newer, especially at a discount. Pocket the difference and save for a rainy day/out of warranty repair. Ambient air and Night vision is something you can’t get beyond 2020. In the long term the “resale” difference on a 2020 or 2021 will be negligible. If anything the fully loaded one will likely be worth a bit more.

Appreciate you weighing in. Can I clarify one thing though, let's say the dealer doesn't come lower than like 63k. Would you still "overpay" for the 20 vs getting a 21 for 5-6k more? I'm trying to get a sense of what 1 MY is worth, options any milage being equal

[Archie007]

Originally Posted by tkelley86

. Especially in this market where used cars are highly sought-after. X7's for whatever reason seem to be somewhat insulated from what's happening across the industry (i.e. they're not holding there value as much as say a GLS580).

Interesting. I got the impression that used car market wasn't doing well. You're saying they're in high demand? Maybe just not x7s?

[tkelley86]

Originally Posted by Archie007

Interesting. I got the impression that used car market wasn't doing well. You're saying they're in high demand? Maybe just not x7s?

Yeah used car market is still crazy. This article talks about it and is current. Basically, everyone is broke and inflation is hurting most Americans. So people are opting for used cars over new to save some money. Which drives up demand and used car prices. They expect it will get better in 2024 but we're still really far away from pre-covid conditions.

https://www.autoremarketing.com/ar/despite-somewhat-soft-finish-used-car-sales-better-than-expected-in-2023/

However, X7's specifically are easily going for half off MSRP in 2-3 years with 30-50k miles. That's not the norm with cars or luxury cars.

[keg97]

The general used car market might be different than the 20-21 loaded X7 M50i market! You're looking for a very specific machine compared to the rank and file who just need an engine/4 wheels to get them around. BMW dealers are usually willing to sit on their inventory for a bit, knowing "somebody" will come by and get what they have.

As for your question about 5/6K more for a new model year... Consider how long you'll be keeping it. Look at the depreciation curve by seeing the differences between similar 19/20's. If you're keeping it beyond a few years, that difference will be lost long term. But I'd be more focused on finding exactly what I wanted and condition. You can usually tell if a car was garaged or not. Both my wife and I are light so I'm always annoyed by leather creasing.

[tkelley86]

Originally Posted by keg97

The general used car market might be different than the 20-21 loaded X7 M50i market! You're looking for a very specific machine compared to the rank and file who just need an engine/4 wheels to get them around. BMW dealers are usually willing to sit on their inventory for a bit, knowing "somebody" will come by and get what they have.

As for your question about 5/6K more for a new model year... Consider how long you'll be keeping it. Look at the depreciation curve by seeing the differences between similar 19/20's. If you're keeping it beyond a few years, that difference will be lost long term. But I'd be more focused on finding exactly what I wanted and condition. You can usually tell if a car was garaged or not. Both my wife and I are light so I'm always annoyed by leather creasing.

All valid stuff and great advice on predicting depreciation by looking at 2019/2020's.

Also agree on buy what you want! Whats 5-6k when you're spending 55-70k? You'll forget about spending the extra money in no time but you'll ALWAYS regret not getting that one extra option or that exact color combo you wanted.

This X7 will be my 5th or 6th expensive car and I always regret leaving critical options (subjective per person) on the table.

[Tinbad]

Originally Posted by Archie007

Appreciate you weighing in. Can I clarify one thing though, let's say the dealer doesn't come lower than like 63k. Would you still "overpay" for the 20 vs getting a 21 for 5-6k more? I'm trying to get a sense of what 1 MY is worth, options any milage being equal

Let me put it this way: I will always prioritize condition/options/spec over “getting a deal”. I’d rather “overpay” by a couple thousand for a specimen that’s a fully loaded spec with options I want, low-ish miles, great condition, good history, etc. than getting the best price but compromising on something else. Now of course if you have two identical vehicles and one is a 20 and another 21 priced similarly, the 21 will be a better buy. However in my experience the 21-22 are generally less loaded, also due to certain options completely going away.

The couple thousand you may “save” now will not matter in the long term ownership. If the car checks all the boxes, don’t get too obsessed over trying to steal it. Negotiate in good faith, bring data to the dealer if you think their price is ways off. I was able to get a $75k CPO down to $72k. I was happy with the result but would’ve probably purchased at asking if it came down to it. Car had all the options I wanted in the exact color/spec. I could try and get the best price with the risk of having to wait many more months until a similar spec would come on the market. And remember your time is worth something too. If you see a perfect one, jump on it and be prepared to maybe overpay a little. Which again, will be negligible over long term ownership.

Also remember vehicles aren’t investments, you lose money no matter what. I’d rather enjoy a “perfect” depreciating vehicle.

[knightrider2k2]

I am not sure if these prices people mention are OTD or just the car purchase price. I recently bought a 2021 m50i (35k miles) with DHP, Cold Weather, Executive, Luxury, extended Merino, Leather Dash, B&W & Driving assist pro. I think that's every option except Full Merino. I wanted bench, but could not find on my side of country so settled for captains chairs (also an option).

I paid 66K + taxes. I believe I could have negotiated another 2-3K off, but got impatient and pulled the trigger.

I won't get stuck on CPO unless you are not planning to get extended warranty.

Check when the brakes were replaces and account for that. Anything over 35K miles likely have the brake job done already. I would recommend getting the Care+ package that will likely take care of brakes when they need replacement next.

Good luck!

[Archie007]

I've been talking in listing price. Most dealers I've talked to are taking on some BS 300-1k charge on top of the list price.

Appreciate you story, thank you for sharing.

Taking in the feedback, reached out to the dealership today to see the price move up to the low 70s k.

Their story was the 65k price is was originally listed by their system but they've only had the car for a few days and haven't even taken it in to set what service it would need so they set it really high just to be safe

They said they'd call me back tomorrow to discuss pricing. I think at this point, I'm willing to pay mid 60s like some suggested but will try and knock off as much as I can.

The only concern now is Id be buying this out of state (it's in FL, I'm north east). Maybe I'm being crazy, but if they know I'm out of state and they have someone already interested, are they potentially incentived to not fix certain things that may come up when they take it in for service? I'll probably do a PPI if we get close enough on price but wondering if this situation raises any red flags for anyone.

[tkelley86]

Originally Posted by Tinbad

Let me put it this way: I will always prioritize condition/options/spec over “getting a deal”. I’d rather “overpay” by a couple thousand for a specimen that’s a fully loaded spec with options I want, low-ish miles, great condition, good history, etc. than getting the best price but compromising on something else. Now of course if you have two identical vehicles and one is a 20 and another 21 priced similarly, the 21 will be a better buy. However in my experience the 21-22 are generally less loaded, also due to certain options completely going away.

The couple thousand you may “save” now will not matter in the long term ownership. If the car checks all the boxes, don’t get too obsessed over trying to steal it. Negotiate in good faith, bring data to the dealer if you think their price is ways off. I was able to get a $75k CPO down to $72k. I was happy with the result but would’ve probably purchased at asking if it came down to it. Car had all the options I wanted in the exact color/spec. I could try and get the best price with the risk of having to wait many more months until a similar spec would come on the market. And remember your time is worth something too. If you see a perfect one, jump on it and be prepared to maybe overpay a little. Which again, will be negligible over long term ownership.

Also remember vehicles aren’t investments, you lose money no matter what. I’d rather enjoy a “perfect” depreciating vehicle.

Preach brotha! My sentiments exactly. I didn't approach luxury car shopping like this when I was younger but I sure do now.