[exokiss]

I stumbled upon this Reddit post here,(no intention of advertising nor being endorsed by Reddit) and goukus1982 words really concern me.
Last night I was on I-87N(by Yankee Stadium) when a speeding idiot with UHAUL truck slapped my face with a silver-dollar-pancake size crack on my windshield. Felt like, I'm in middle of the Matrix movie set.
Long story short, A lot of mixed feedback from Reddit, Bimmerpost and Bimmerfest and honestly I'm confused.
Some say, Don't even bother going to the dealer because they'll start playing their games "Oh, it's gonna be very hard to convince the insurance about getting an OEM glass", and nonsense like that;
While others say Safelite service is ok but only when it comes to replacing OEM from Fuyao. So question now is,
Do I still stick with BMW's OEM from Fuyao, or insist for Saint Gobain Sekurit or Pilkington glass?
Nowadays companies use laminated layer made of PVB/UVA, which absorbs UV-A, as well as provide noise isolation, but from my research so far, Fuyao tends to "comfort" and seems to pick up chips at a slightly faster rate(based on complaints) than the OEM glass from Pilkington or Saint Gobain Sekurit. I'm sure no one would like double-vision distortion, leaks, faulty rain/light sensors and/or noise while driving.
Can you share your experience and what you'd do if you're in my shoes? I appreciate your time. Thanks.

[jmciver]

Interesting timing with your post.... I just had my windshield replaced by the dealer due to a tint shop accident. The dealer replaced it (or technically the body shop that is attached/affiliated with the dealer), and used all BMW parts (the tint shop paid for the replacement, not an insurance company). Total cost for all parts and labor was just under $3k. Should there be any issues, I have the full warranty honored by BMW, just like any other component on the X7.

The glass used was OEM by Fuyao (with the BMW symbol) and I can't tell any difference with internal road noise or visibility from the original windshield installed at the factory. I was concerned about the physical install so I even compared my X7 to other new X7's on the dealer's lot and didn't see anything to worry about. My X7 only had 1800 miles on the clock when I had the windshield replaced last week so I have no data on the durability of the windshield. But based on my limited experience thus far, I would say don't worry about it as long as all OEM parts are used, which includes a new rain sensor.

But what I would tell you is to ensure the shop that does the work follows the window replacement procedure, which requires re-calibration of the camera on the windshield (the KAFAS module). The shop forgot to do the recalibration and I had an error in iDrive that did not go away. Four days later, some mandatory troubleshooting with BMW Germany, and almost replacing the Body Domain Controller (which is the $1000+ computer brain of the car), the dealer ended up replacing the KAFAS camera and all is well in the world - and I even got a software update to the latest and greatest at the time of this post.

Good luck.

[mitch57]

Originally Posted by jmciver

But what I would tell you is to ensure the shop that does the work follows the window replacement procedure, which requires re-calibration of the camera on the windshield (the KAFAS module). The shop forgot to do the recalibration and I had an error in iDrive that did not go away. Four days later, some mandatory troubleshooting with BMW Germany, and almost replacing the Body Domain Controller (which is the $1000+ computer brain of the car), the dealer ended up replacing the KAFAS camera and all is well in the world - and I even got a software update to the latest and greatest at the time of this post.

Good luck.

I'm confused. Are you saying that recalibration can't be done after the windshield is installed? Why would the KAFAS camera fail after a windshield replacement? Perhaps I'm missing something or the tint company broke the camera when they were doing the tint which also required replacing the windshield and the camera. Isn't the camera inside the top of the dashboard?

[jmciver]

Originally Posted by mitch57

I'm confused. Are you saying that recalibration can't be done after the windshield is installed? Why would the KAFAS camera fail after a windshield replacement? Perhaps I'm missing something or the tint company broke the camera when they were doing the tint which also required replacing the windshield and the camera. Isn't the camera inside the top of the dashboard?

Ok, since you asked, let me provide a few more details....

The tint company did not break the KAFAS camera. They scratched the glass on the outside of the windshield when they were cutting/fitting the piece of tint to go on the windshield. It was an unfortunate mistake, but they immediately came clean (they voluntarily pointed it out to me), and offered to pay for a new windshield, using the dealer to install (which means OEM/stock parts). For the few days I drove my X7 until I could get on the dealer's schedule, there were no issues with the X7 - just a scratch on the windshield.

After the dealer replaced the windshield, I got an error in iDrive shortly after driving off the lot, which you can see below:



I thought no big deal since it seemed like the car would "reset itself" after a short drive. Now, this should have been checked by the dealership before I picked up my X7, but I didn't feel like going back so I would at least give the X7 the opportunity to fix itself. Unfortunately, that did not happen. During that same drive cycle (I was driving home) I got another fault in iDrive stating there was an issue with the KAFAS camera. But before I went back to the dealer, I wanted to get home, turn of the X7 and see if that would help finish the reset (as that has worked in the past for other vehicles with similar electrical issues). Of note, I only noticed these faults because I was using the driver assistance systems, which were partially disabled. If I had not been using them, the initial fault may never have showed up, but I don't know for sure.

The next day I drove the X7 and the same faults appeared shortly after starting my drive, so I took it back to the dealer to take a look. Before I did, I went online to look at the window replacement procedure, and the last step of the procedure is to recalibrate the KAFAS camera, which makes sense because it is unplugged during the windshield replacement procedure. When I explained what was happening, including mentioning the KAFAS re-calibration procedure, the body shop manager admittedly was not aware of this procedural step even though it was her techs, not the regular maintenance techs, that replaced the windshield - and the body shop has actually replaced several BMW windshields (they even had a second X7 windshield replacement in the shop the same time as mine). The body shop techs, while BMW trained, are separate from the the maintenance techs that handle the non-body shop work on BMWs at the dealer.

Once in the BMW service department (not the body shop), the first step was to re-calibrate the KAFAS camera - but the same errors returned. The next troubleshooting step required a software update (that is how I got 3/2020.58 installed - yay ), but after the update a different fault appeared that pointed to a faulty camera in the dash (the one that monitors you to make sure you are awake, etc) AND a failed Body Domain Controller (BDC). Since the diagnostic computer called out the replacement for the BDC, which is a high dollar part, the engineers at BMW Germany needed to get involved before the BDC is authorized for warranty replacement. So the techs are going down a bit of a rabbit hole IMHO, but they are following the authorized BMW trouble shooting procedures using their BMW diagnostic computers. Although, I am still convinced the issue is with the KAFAS camera, not the internal camera or the BDC, since the KAFAS camera was the only electronic equipment that was touched with the windshield install, and it gave the initial fault in iDrive.

Eventually, after some more troubleshooting, including some "old school" methods to help determine which components may be at fault when the diagnostic computer is not very clear, they swapped out the KAFAS camera for a new one, ran the KAFAS calibration (which is required when installing a new KAFAS camera module), did a proper/thorough road test, and all is well now. The final explanation of what happened is that there was a communications fault between the KAFAS, internal camera, and the BDC. The diagnostic computer incorrectly determined the BDC was faulty (requiring replacement), when it was actually the KAFAS module that was causing the communications faults between these components. However, after the KAFAS was replaced, all components communicated properly and all systems began to function normally, as designed. So what I suspect happened is that the KAFAS module, which must be removed as part of the windshield replacement procedure, was damaged in some way.

While this was definitely an inconvenience, the dealership went above and beyond to work with me, including keeping me informed with the additional details that your typical customer does not usually ask for. This included the shop foreman providing me with multiple detailed, email updates on the troubleshooting status of my X7. When I picked up my X7, I took the opportunity to find the shop foreman to thank him for his support (especially the emails) and we had a good 25 min conversation talking about my X7 issue (for example, he told me that during the troubleshooting they noticed the KAFAS camera got hot, despite the diagnostic computer still not pointing to the KAFAS as the potential problem) and other BMW tech stuff - it was great for a BMW DIY guy like me and I learned some stuff.

Nobody likes it when your stuff breaks, but at least the customer service I received during this ordeal was what it is supposed to be IMHO, which unfortunately does not always happen like it should at every dealership. Looking back at this ordeal, I remember that I was tempted to not have the windshield replaced because I knew something like this could happen - especially since the scratch was not that big and was in a pretty inconspicuous spot. But I knew my OCD would eventually get the best of me so I decided to have it done, only at the dealership, so that if anything did go wrong with the replacement, I would have the full backing of BMW warranty accountability for the work to address any potential issues - and BMW did exactly what I would have expected them to do (so I am a happy BMW customer).

Here is the windshield replacement procedure if you are curious...

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/g...dow/1VndMm9A4x

Any more questions ?

[jmciver]

Originally Posted by exokiss

I stumbled upon this Reddit post here,(no intention of advertising nor being endorsed by Reddit) and goukus1982 words really concern me.
Last night I was on I-87N(by Yankee Stadium) when a speeding idiot with UHAUL truck slapped my face with a silver-dollar-pancake size crack on my windshield. Felt like, I'm in middle of the Matrix movie set.
Long story short, A lot of mixed feedback from Reddit, Bimmerpost and Bimmerfest and honestly I'm confused.
Some say, Don't even bother going to the dealer because they'll start playing their games "Oh, it's gonna be very hard to convince the insurance about getting an OEM glass", and nonsense like that;
While others say Safelite service is ok but only when it comes to replacing OEM from Fuyao. So question now is,
Do I still stick with BMW's OEM from Fuyao, or insist for Saint Gobain Sekurit or Pilkington glass?
Nowadays companies use laminated layer made of PVB/UVA, which absorbs UV-A, as well as provide noise isolation, but from my research so far, Fuyao tends to "comfort" and seems to pick up chips at a slightly faster rate(based on complaints) than the OEM glass from Pilkington or Saint Gobain Sekurit. I'm sure no one would like double-vision distortion, leaks, faulty rain/light sensors and/or noise while driving.
Can you share your experience and what you'd do if you're in my shoes? I appreciate your time. Thanks.

One other data point for you.... I don't know/remember what the brand was of my original windshield as I didn't think to look. But FWIW, after reading your post I noticed that the other windows on the X7 are also made by Fuyao, at least on my X7....

[mitch57]

Originally Posted by jmciver

Ok, since you asked, let me provide a few more details....

The tint company did not break the KAFAS camera. They scratched the glass on the outside of the windshield when they were cutting/fitting the piece of tint to go on the windshield. It was an unfortunate mistake, but they immediately came clean (they voluntarily pointed it out to me), and offered to pay for a new windshield, using the dealer to install (which means OEM/stock parts). For the few days I drove my X7 until I could get on the dealer's schedule, there were no issues with the X7 - just a scratch on the windshield.

After the dealer replaced the windshield, I got an error in iDrive shortly after driving off the lot, which you can see below:



I thought no big deal since it seemed like the car would "reset itself" after a short drive. Now, this should have been checked by the dealership before I picked up my X7, but I didn't feel like going back so I would at least give the X7 the opportunity to fix itself. Unfortunately, that did not happen. During that same drive cycle (I was driving home) I got another fault in iDrive stating there was an issue with the KAFAS camera. But before I went back to the dealer, I wanted to get home, turn of the X7 and see if that would help finish the reset (as that has worked in the past for other vehicles with similar electrical issues). Of note, I only noticed these faults because I was using the driver assistance systems, which were partially disabled. If I had not been using them, the initial fault may never have showed up, but I don't know for sure.

The next day I drove the X7 and the same faults appeared shortly after starting my drive, so I took it back to the dealer to take a look. Before I did, I went online to look at the window replacement procedure, and the last step of the procedure is to recalibrate the KAFAS camera, which makes sense because it is unplugged during the windshield replacement procedure. When I explained what was happening, including mentioning the KAFAS re-calibration procedure, the body shop manager admittedly was not aware of this procedural step even though it was her techs, not the regular maintenance techs, that replaced the windshield - and the body shop has actually replaced several BMW windshields (they even had a second X7 windshield replacement in the shop the same time as mine). The body shop techs, while BMW trained, are separate from the the maintenance techs that handle the non-body shop work on BMWs at the dealer.

Once in the BMW service department (not the body shop), the first step was to re-calibrate the KAFAS camera - but the same errors returned. The next troubleshooting step required a software update (that is how I got 3/2020.58 installed - yay ), but after the update a different fault appeared that pointed to a faulty camera in the dash (the one that monitors you to make sure you are awake, etc) AND a failed Body Domain Controller (BDC). Since the diagnostic computer called out the replacement for the BDC, which is a high dollar part, the engineers at BMW Germany needed to get involved before the BDC is authorized for warranty replacement. So the techs are going down a bit of a rabbit hole IMHO, but they are following the authorized BMW trouble shooting procedures using their BMW diagnostic computers. Although, I am still convinced the issue is with the KAFAS camera, not the internal camera or the BDC, since the KAFAS camera was the only electronic equipment that was touched with the windshield install, and it gave the initial fault in iDrive.

Eventually, after some more troubleshooting, including some "old school" methods to help determine which components may be at fault when the diagnostic computer is not very clear, they swapped out the KAFAS camera for a new one, ran the KAFAS calibration (which is required when installing a new KAFAS camera module), did a proper/thorough road test, and all is well now. The final explanation of what happened is that there was a communications fault between the KAFAS, internal camera, and the BDC. The diagnostic computer incorrectly determined the BDC was faulty (requiring replacement), when it was actually the KAFAS module that was causing the communications faults between these components. However, after the KAFAS was replaced, all components communicated properly and all systems began to function normally, as designed. So what I suspect happened is that the KAFAS module, which must be removed as part of the windshield replacement procedure, was damaged in some way.

While this was definitely an inconvenience, the dealership went above and beyond to work with me, including keeping me informed with the additional details that your typical customer does not usually ask for. This included the shop foreman providing me with multiple detailed, email updates on the troubleshooting status of my X7. When I picked up my X7, I took the opportunity to find the shop foreman to thank him for his support (especially the emails) and we had a good 25 min conversation talking about my X7 issue (for example, he told me that during the troubleshooting they noticed the KAFAS camera got hot, despite the diagnostic computer still not pointing to the KAFAS as the potential problem) and other BMW tech stuff - it was great for a BMW DIY guy like me and I learned some stuff.

Nobody likes it when your stuff breaks, but at least the customer service I received during this ordeal was what it is supposed to be IMHO, which unfortunately does not always happen like it should at every dealership. Looking back at this ordeal, I remember that I was tempted to not have the windshield replaced because I knew something like this could happen - especially since the scratch was not that big and was in a pretty inconspicuous spot. But I knew my OCD would eventually get the best of me so I decided to have it done, only at the dealership, so that if anything did go wrong with the replacement, I would have the full backing of BMW warranty accountability for the work to address any potential issues - and BMW did exactly what I would have expected them to do (so I am a happy BMW customer).

Here is the windshield replacement procedure if you are curious...

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/g...dow/1VndMm9A4x

Any more questions ?

Makes sense now. Just the answer I was looking for from a career Navy man. After all, It's all about the details...

[mitch57]

Originally Posted by jmciver

One other data point for you.... I don't know/remember what the brand was of my original windshield as I didn't think to look. But FWIW, after reading your post I noticed that the other windows on the X7 are also made by Fuyao, at least on my X7....

Just for further confirmation on what BMW is using for windshield glass is my windshield as delivered with my custom ordered X7 x40i.

On a side note, someone posted their concerns with the Fuyao over the other BMW OEM windshield glass. They had heard that the Fuyao is much softer glass and more prone to nicks and chips. I would have to agree with that statement based on what I've experienced with my windshield. An SUV in front of me (A brand new Hyundai Palisade) threw a tiny pebble that shouldn't have even nicked the windshield. However, it did chip the windshield but not enough to crack it or warrant any repairs to the windshield. It's very tiny and most would never see it unless they were looking for it.

A small rock like that has never caused any damage to any of my other vehicles. So the other poster may be right about Fuyao manufacturing windshields out of softer glass which is more prone to damage from small impacts.

[exokiss]

So what must be re-calibrated is the KAFAS, rain and HUD after the replacement, did I get it right?

[jmciver]

Originally Posted by exokiss

So what must be re-calibrated is the KAFAS, rain and HUD after the replacement, did I get it right?

Just the KAFAS according to the factory procedure...

[Kruppa]

2020 M50i produced 7/20 and I also have Fuyao. Day 3 with the car a pebble from highway construction left a 1 inch (edge to edge) crack on the lower passenger side. Never had a single issue with any of my other BMWs with years of highway driving but who knows maybe just bad luck vs material issue. I had it repaired today and it’s slightly less visible but you can still see the edges - at least it’s nowhere near my field of view on drivers side. I have a really long road trip coming up so I’ll make sure nothing else happens and if it annoys me enough I’ll look into getting it replaced through the dealer.

[Kruppa]

Originally Posted by Kruppa

2020 M50i produced 7/20 and I also have Fuyao. Day 3 with the car a pebble from highway construction left a 1 inch (edge to edge) crack on the lower passenger side. Never had a single issue with any of my other BMWs with years of highway driving but who knows maybe just bad luck vs material issue. I had it repaired today and it’s slightly less visible but you can still see the edges - at least it’s nowhere near my field of view on drivers side. I have a really long road trip coming up so I’ll make sure nothing else happens and if it annoys me enough I’ll look into getting it replaced through the dealer.

I just called Safelite to schedule replacement. I asked if it would be the factory OEM glass and they said yes. There is no generic option, the vehicle is too new. They ordered replacement directly from BMW. They also knew about the KAFAS calibration before I could even tell them and said they are able to do that on their own with tools they have. FYI for others that may be affected. I'm going to assume it's Fuyao again but will reply here if not.