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View Poll Results: Where does fault lie?
Criminal charges should be filed. Stewart is finished in racing. 30 11.11%
Should lose a lawsuit, but Stewart can salvage his career. 8 2.96%
Tragic accident, blame on both sides. 68 25.19%
Jeff Ward shouldn't have walked on the track. 164 60.74%
Voters: 270. You may not vote on this poll

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      08-10-2014, 03:34 PM   #23
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If the kid never gets out, do we have what we have? No! The poor kid was the hot head here.
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      08-10-2014, 03:37 PM   #24
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The Rev no rev thing is gonna have to come from on board data. Can't tell who is reving what could have been from a car closer to the camera you hear.
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      08-10-2014, 03:51 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zx10guy View Post
I don't see how Tony was pushing he limits of his car during the yellow. He was circulating at the same speed as everyone else. There's no video of the events prior to the one recorded in the video. But to me what lead to Ward crashing was just a racing incident.
While I agree it was a tragic racing incident, I can see how someone easily would be perhaps showboating and whatnot during a yellow. Here's this celebrity running in a series that's well "below" his norm and with a more prestigious race of the same sort just a few miles up the road. And still, under caution, a lot of throttle is used (which to me explains the rev dilemma).

It was an accident, for sure, and I think whether Tony was showboating or not is academic at this point, if he was going slower this kid probably would have still been killed (I hate to say that)
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      08-10-2014, 04:01 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by URBAN LEGEND View Post
If the kid never gets out, do we have what we have? No! The poor kid was the hot head here.
This is obvious. But one ignorant action doesn't absolve someone of culpability for a criminal act that follows. (I'm not saying Stewart's action was conclusively criminal.)
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      08-10-2014, 04:13 PM   #27
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Wasn't there a camera on Tony's car of some sort, I wonder? I'm sure it was confiscated, if so.

At first I thought he must have been looking @ Ward's car looking for him there & goosed the throttle while he was looking in the direction of the car--when he was right in front of him...

Very, very sad & I'm sure Stewart is sick--he'll need to live w/ that the rest of his life.
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      08-10-2014, 04:13 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaMMM View Post
This is obvious. But one ignorant action doesn't absolve someone of culpability for a criminal act that follows. (I'm not saying Stewart's action was conclusively criminal.)
It's all good with me. Doesn't affect me at all.
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      08-10-2014, 04:28 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by consolidated View Post
The first thing your told before you get on any track is DO NOT GET OUT OF YOUR CAR. Ward needed to express himself to the celebrity, a bit of posturing that got him killed. Even if Stewart shares some fault, the huge majority of it rests with Ward.

They should have red flagged the race after he got out of his car, but this is different world than the one I'm used to.

I will say, at first I thought Stewart's line of sight might have been blocked, but it appears that he should have had a clear view of Ward. However, on track, your eyes are only looking for cars, corners and walls NOT people, easy to miss if your not expecting a guy in a black suit hopping around a live track.
Yep. Especially since the area this happened was on the back part of the track unlit with the drivers going towards the lighting in the spectator stands, the brown dirt of the track, the dark wooded background, and Ward's black suit.
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      08-10-2014, 04:30 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 954Stealth View Post
While I agree it was a tragic racing incident, I can see how someone easily would be perhaps showboating and whatnot during a yellow. Here's this celebrity running in a series that's well "below" his norm and with a more prestigious race of the same sort just a few miles up the road. And still, under caution, a lot of throttle is used (which to me explains the rev dilemma).

It was an accident, for sure, and I think whether Tony was showboating or not is academic at this point, if he was going slower this kid probably would have still been killed (I hate to say that)
100% agree.
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      08-10-2014, 04:38 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete_z89 View Post
The link that someone posted earlier in this thread on deadspin.com has a different audio "alignment with the video" than other videos I've seen. Here's one on Youtube:

I've also seen another on thirdworldsociety.com and it has the same audio as the one on the youtube link I just posted.

In the link I posted, you hear the rev precisely about 1 second PRIOR to the impact, making it appear that Tony was attempting to scare Kevin, and ended up unintentionally killing him.

My conclusion is that it was an unintentional impact, and yes the kid was dumb for getting out of his car, but it is definitely Tony's fault for killing him. No question. You rev your car to scare, and you unintentionally kill him. I believe that is what will come of the lawsuit.
Sorry still don't hear the rev before impact and this is the video I saw which has to me better audio:



And no one is going to convince me Tony is at fault at all for this unless there is something more than the video being circulated around. Rev or not, Tony did not deviate drastically off his driving line to hit Ward. Had Ward been standing near his car pointing at him and Tony hit him, yes, Tony would be 100% liable. The fact Ward thought it was ok not only to leave his vehicle but to purposely walk towards the driving line on a hot race track is 100% his fault. Freak things happen on a race track and all these drivers knows the risk. Heck, I know the risks when I get onto a race track and when I sign that waiver form.
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      08-10-2014, 04:47 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shredicus View Post
I'd guess it was just aggressive posturing that went very wrong.
This, times a billion.

Ward had absolutely NO business walking onto the track like he did. I've been to a few of these types of races, and honestly this happens quite often. One time, I literally saw two drivers pull down onto the apron, get our of their cars, and start fist fighting while the race was still going on. This was in Roanoke, VA around 1996.
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      08-10-2014, 04:58 PM   #33
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First thought Ward was doing the dance (spectators love) and Stewart miscalculated his counter-move. Figure Stewart has incredible eyesight even through a dirty visor.
I also think lighting wasn't an issue, if anything the lighting was perfect.

Now I think Ward is a stupid MF'er. For a second his driving suit seems to blend in to his ride as he steps in front of it. And then he appears to pop out from the blue car in front of Stewart - I think Stewart tried to avoid Ward. Wondering who was wearing a GoPro.

I feel bad for Stewart - he should have raced today.
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      08-10-2014, 05:17 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zx10guy View Post
Sorry still don't hear the rev before impact and this is the video I saw which has to me better audio:



And no one is going to convince me Tony is at fault at all for this unless there is something more than the video being circulated around. Rev or not, Tony did not deviate drastically off his driving line to hit Ward. Had Ward been standing near his car pointing at him and Tony hit him, yes, Tony would be 100% liable. The fact Ward thought it was ok not only to leave his vehicle but to purposely walk towards the driving line on a hot race track is 100% his fault. Freak things happen on a race track and all these drivers knows the risk. Heck, I know the risks when I get onto a race track and when I sign that waiver form.
You don't hear it? Impossible not to. At 35s you hear the motor rev the car accelerate and get a little sideways right before he runs Ward over. Seems very clear to me what happened. You can also see how much slower the other cars are traveling considering the race was under a yellow flag. Tony attempted to scare Ward and unintentionally killed him.
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      08-10-2014, 05:30 PM   #35
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See the point I've been trying to make is the amount of throttling done in Sprint Series. Well, there's a lot. He was throttling the car not for malicious intent but because that's what they do. You hear revs and you detect acceleration and yadayadayada. Fine.

He's been around for a while. This was not murder. This was not a vet scaring a newb. This was an accident.

Plain and simple: tragic accident.

Sometimes it's hard not to make sense of these things without pointing blame. I get that. But it does neither party justice. Lets just take it as an accident and a tragic loss of life and sympathize with Tony (Imagine what's going through his head right now) instead of all the conjecture and finger pointing.

I'll get off my high horse now
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      08-10-2014, 05:37 PM   #36
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I will say in a race red mist takes over a lot of drivers and leads to stupid, regrettable behavior. But I believe Stewart being an a old vet has more control than that despite his reputation. He had nothing to gain and everything to lose. I have a feeling Stewart will say he didn't see him until the last second. Look at how visibility is minimized by the right side wing endplate, it's like driving with a 4x8 plywood blinder on your right side.

Terrifying to see Ward's body twisted like that, the safety workers look tells the story that he was likely dead already. Even though the yellow flag was out the cars were still doing what looks like 60 mph, Ward may have gotten knocked under by the anti-overlap bar and wrapped under the rear wheel, and then throw. A horrible, sad accident.

I'll be interested and surely shocked by what the press and public who don't know racing turn this into. We love destroying celebrities, especially ones with a history of bad behavior.

Stewart is not going to be the same person after this.

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Last edited by consolidated; 08-10-2014 at 06:02 PM..
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      08-10-2014, 05:37 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBoosting View Post
You don't hear it? Impossible not to. At 35s you hear the motor rev the car accelerate and get a little sideways right before he runs Ward over. Seems very clear to me what happened. You can also see how much slower the other cars are traveling considering the race was under a yellow flag. Tony attempted to scare Ward and unintentionally killed him.
Yes I heard it but you can't tell me from the video it was before impact. You don't even see Ward before the rev. The car was sideways as the car was traveling down the track with ward underneath it.

I don't see how you can also make the claim Tony was traveling faster than other cars circulating around the track.

Also everyone who is pointing fault at Tony seem to conveniently ignore how #45 had to avoid Ward as Ward stormed into the path of traffic.

I'm no Stewart fan boy. In fact I think any racer who gets sucked into NASCAR sold themselves out for made for TV racing. I'm looking at this as a racing fan and as someone who has been on track who has avoided crashes and been in one.
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      08-10-2014, 05:44 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zx10guy View Post
Yes I heard it but you can't tell me from the video it was before impact. You don't even see Ward before the rev. The car was sideways as the car was traveling down the track with ward underneath it.

I don't see how you can also make the claim Tony was traveling faster than other cars circulating around the track.

Also everyone who is pointing fault at Tony seem to conveniently ignore how #45 had to avoid Ward as Ward stormed into the path of traffic.

I'm no Stewart fan boy. In fact I think any racer who gets sucked into NASCAR sold themselves out for made for TV racing. I'm looking at this as a racing fan and as someone who has been on track who has avoided crashes and been in one.
These arnt just my opinions. There are reports from people in the stands describing the exact same thing I just did. According to several people that were in attendance including another driver that wasn't participating that night he appeared to be attempting to scare Ward and it ended badly.

Hopefully some clearer footage comes out. In the end it will be almost impossible to prove anything either way.

Last edited by BigBoosting; 08-10-2014 at 05:49 PM..
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      08-10-2014, 07:43 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by consolidated View Post
Stewart is not going to be the same person after this.
If Tony didn't intentionally run over Ward, he'll have some mental challenges but should be able bounce back.

Valentino Rossi had to deal with running over Marco Simoncelli killing him. The worst part of the whole thing, they were very good friends. Rossi was able to bounce back and he's doing well in the series.
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      08-10-2014, 07:53 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zx10guy View Post
If Tony didn't intentionally run over Ward, he'll have some mental challenges but should be able bounce back.

Valentino Rossi had to deal with running over Marco Simoncelli killing him. The worst part of the whole thing, they were very good friends. Rossi was able to bounce back and he's doing well in the series.
God, I remember that, awful.

More than his mental well being and conscious, he'll have other challenges, sponsorship, legal, civil proceedings, a public investigation, the media...because this isn't going to be as clear of a racing accident as Simoncelli's was. There was no finger pointing or blame then, just a straight up tragedy.
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      08-10-2014, 08:57 PM   #41
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I just find it pretty ironic that Stewart was the one who made him spin out and then he's the one who hit him. I've watched the video a bunch of times. Why were the other drivers able to avoid him? I don't know. Just seems he was trying to scare him and it went horribly wrong. Stewart will be the only one that knows the truth.
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      08-10-2014, 09:09 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete_z89 View Post
My conclusion is that it was an unintentional impact, and yes the kid was dumb for getting out of his car, but it is definitely Tony's fault for killing him. No question. You rev your car to scare, and you unintentionally kill him. I believe that is what will come of the lawsuit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBoosting View Post
You can also see how much slower the other cars are traveling considering the race was under a yellow flag. Tony attempted to scare Ward and unintentionally killed him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haywood View Post
Why were the other drivers able to avoid him? I don't know. Just seems he was trying to scare him and it went horribly wrong.
These. Ward had to jump OUT of the way, he wasn't going into Tony's path. Rather, Tony seemed to be aiming towards the kid.

Also, enough of the silliness arguing if Tony wanted to kill Ward. This isn't Mad Max or the Thunderdome. Of course he was only trying to scare him and screwed up majorly. Both at fault, Tony is not 100% innocent, guy drove faster than the other drivers and closer to Ward when it all could've been avoided.
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      08-10-2014, 09:36 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haywood View Post
I just find it pretty ironic that Stewart was the one who made him spin out and then he's the one who hit him. I've watched the video a bunch of times. Why were the other drivers able to avoid him? I don't know. Just seems he was trying to scare him and it went horribly wrong. Stewart will be the only one that knows the truth.
Because Ward wasn't trying to charge at them.
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      08-10-2014, 10:11 PM   #44
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Learn to drive a sprint car and then make a proper judgment.

The media is making Tony Stewart out to be this huge villain, but until you learn to drive a sprint car, don't make a judgment on if he was right or wrong
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