[Propofoln]

Man. My 2023 X7 M60i on 22s is so damn comfortable and quiet I can’t imagine needing any more “comfort”

[KillerCut]

I test drove a 23 XB7, it rode like a jeep, which means it rode like a boat, not good at all. I drove the 24 M60i at the performance center and it was ok, maybe a little too stiff. I have a 24 40i with dynamic handling package and 21" wheels, and it rides great. Just enable sport dampening when you want to take corners like the m60i...
The 40i weights 5417 lbs, m60i weights 5895lbs, the XB7 weights 5986lbs.
The 40i has the same b58 engine as the toyota supra, with just a racechip gts black you get nearly 500hp, compared to 525hp in the m60i or 575hp if you put the racechip in that. I did not get the sport package, as I wanted the elegant look with chrome, but I loaded up on all the good stuff, came out to under $100k with incentives... The XB7 is too slow for what you are paying for. At that price I would expect 0-60 under 3 seconds.

My wife has a 23 X5MC and I had to put 20" wheels on it, the ride is too harsh, that car is seriously on rails and closer to a 0-60 around 3.0 sec with just a racechip (800hp)...

[ledphut]

You must be smoking that good stuff if you think the XB7 drives like a Jeep..

Also; what SUV is hitting 0-60 in under 3 seconds?

[XM Label]

There are no three row ICE SUVs that do 0-60 in 3 seconds. When buying an XB7 you don’t buy it for straight line performance. Not for everyone but it’s an upgrade from regular X7s on so many levels.

[Tyriondo]

Originally Posted by jofbay

Isn't it basically the same car, same parts, just a few Alpina badges and some software tweaks?

I believe this is called marketing with product variety. It helps the company to milk their customers for a higher statue offering. Actually, you get the same product. Like at the video below.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/9YeAi-akkYY

I just read XB7 vs. Rolls-Royce comfort comparison above. That was more interesting to me.

[NewtoForum]

Hi- A bit off-topic but is there much difference in comfort between X7 40i and X7 M60?

[tinfoiltuna]

Originally Posted by NewtoForum

Hi- A bit off-topic but is there much difference in comfort between X7 40i and X7 M60?

I’ve owned both a 2023 40i and M60i, the 40i without DHP, both with 22” wheels - I didn’t notice any difference in ride comfort.

[NewtoForum]

Originally Posted by tinfoiltuna

I’ve owned both a 2023 40i and M60i, the 40i without DHP, both with 22” wheels - I didn’t notice any difference in ride comfort.

Thanks. Test drove 40i. Dealership didn't have M60. Would like to have the more power on M60 but not stiffer ride.

[mjr24]

Originally Posted by Tr4ckD4ys

I knew you were biased and/or M8 owner the moment I read your first post and I unfortunately have to correct you again: You are wrong about the M8. Yes - you do have a choice of sport bucket seats (which in the ALPINA geared toward luxury don’t make sense but in the M geared towards athleticism do). But you do not have a choice of “special materials and exclusivity”. All you are getting is different color choices of full merino. By the way, the B8 has color choices that are full merino which you can’t chose for the M8. Does that make the B8 more special now? No it doesn’t. Neither does it make the M8 more special.

You do not seem to understand though that the ALPINA’s have literally exclusive-ALPINA-only color & material choices (ie the M8 color choices available are the same on the X5M, X6M et cetera; the ALPINA color choices however are only available on the Alpinas). Try to buy Lavalina leather (an upgrade over Merino as per BMW) for the M cars. You can’t. Try to get the ALPINA Blue or Green painting on an M car, no you can’t. All the colors for your M8 are also available to other non-M vehicles, so no, not special. Then add to it that there is trim materials available that are ALPINA exclusive (Myrtle and walnut) but your precious M8 has the same trims available you can get in non-M 8 series, again not special.

And yes. I do get a bit emotional when I see lies being spread as fact just because you want it to be because you spent your money on an M8 instead of B8. Of course you can option the M8 higher priced once you add Ceramic breaks and bucket seats, which are exclusive to M-vehicles. The base price for the B8 is higher though. You sound like you optioned and chose your vehicle based on how expensive you can make it, otherwise why is the $10k MSRP difference of such importance to you that you come here and mislead future buyers and interested folks into believing there is any kind of difference between the vehicles other than a marketing one, which I elaborated on above. And yes, it’s obvious BMW business is getting more out of M-vehicles than ALPINA’s. Their margins and production volume are completely different, as is their target group. Again, that in no way makes the M vehicles more special.

And spare me with your “i know bmw better than you because I have friends of friends”. Any person out there can go to the bmw page and read up those differences. No friends of friends needed. In fact, they might get the info quicker and more accurately than you, given they don’t just rely on hearsay.

Sounds like you are getting a bit emotional because you don't have either model.....

The Alpina models literally look the same as the normal non-M models minus a few badges and the front lip spoiler (which they just tacked on to the front bumper). Definitely not worth the extra money to most.....and regardless of what suspension/engine mods it has......it's still slower than the proper M versions.

The X7 is the one caveat because there is no proper X7M.

[itiongo]

Originally Posted by KillerCut

I test drove a 23 XB7, it rode like a jeep, which means it rode like a boat, not good at all. I drove the 24 M60i at the performance center and it was ok, maybe a little too stiff. I have a 24 40i with dynamic handling package and 21" wheels, and it rides great. Just enable sport dampening when you want to take corners like the m60i...
The 40i weights 5417 lbs, m60i weights 5895lbs, the XB7 weights 5986lbs.
The 40i has the same b58 engine as the toyota supra, with just a racechip gts black you get nearly 500hp, compared to 525hp in the m60i or 575hp if you put the racechip in that. I did not get the sport package, as I wanted the elegant look with chrome, but I loaded up on all the good stuff, came out to under $100k with incentives... The XB7 is too slow for what you are paying for. At that price I would expect 0-60 under 3 seconds.

My wife has a 23 X5MC and I had to put 20" wheels on it, the ride is too harsh, that car is seriously on rails and closer to a 0-60 around 3.0 sec with just a racechip (800hp)...

Hilarious. The M60i you test drove was probably on 22" summer tires. Put those 22" summer tires on your 40i and it'll ride exactly the same. Nearly 500hp with a Racechip... The ride is too harsh on your wife's 23 X5MC... 800hp on a Racechip...

I blacked out my badges on my X7 and now it makes 1000hp.

[Propofoln]

Originally Posted by NewtoForum

Thanks. Test drove 40i. Dealership didn't have M60. Would like to have the more power on M60 but not stiffer ride.

My M60i rides like a dream. So comfortable.

[MystroX5]

Here is a good comparison on how good the X7 M50i was in ride comfort compared to the flagship BMW M760i sedan.

“Some SUVs are a bit choppier on rough pavement than their sedan counterparts, but the gap in ride quality between these two is nearly nonexistent with their cushy adaptive air suspensions. We’re going to give the smallest of wins to the M760i for being just a hair more isolated and quieter than the X7 M50i, but the difference is hardly noticeable. Both are among the most comfortable-riding vehicles one can buy today.”





https://www.autoblog.com/2020/04/21/...7-vs-7-series/

[BMW5and7]

Originally Posted by mjr24

Sounds like you are getting a bit emotional because you don't have either model.....

The Alpina models literally look the same as the normal non-M models minus a few badges and the front lip spoiler (which they just tacked on to the front bumper). Definitely not worth the extra money to most.....and regardless of what suspension/engine mods it has......it's still slower than the proper M versions.

The X7 is the one caveat because there is no proper X7M.

Lol, I agree, and though same exact thing. People are getting super emotional when proven wrong. A proper M or nothing. Everything else is badges in my view once you own and drive a proper M.

[ledphut]

Originally Posted by BMW5and7

Lol, I agree, and though same exact thing. People are getting super emotional when proven wrong. A proper M or nothing. Everything else is badges in my view once you own and drive a proper M.

Your proper M (no matter which one you choose) still couldn’t catch a 2017-2022 Alpina B7 at VMAX (205mph) so there’s definitely more than just badges going on, wouldn’t you say?

[Propofoln]

Originally Posted by BMW5and7

Lol, I agree, and though same exact thing. People are getting super emotional when proven wrong. A proper M or nothing. Everything else is badges in my view once you own and drive a proper M.

Proper M’s ride like crap. I’ll take my amazing riding m60i

[mjr24]

Originally Posted by Propofoln

Proper M’s ride like crap. I’ll take my amazing riding m60i

This whole conversation is pointless considering most X7's have air suspension and there is no actual M variant of the X7 (and no, the M50i and M60i are awesome but are NOT M cars in any way, shape, or form.....especially the suspension).

Not sure how this turned into a XB7 versus.....M8 (?) comparison? And then suddenly it was a B7 versus M8 comparison (the B7 would get smoked like a cheap cigarette BTW).

[Propofoln]

Noting wrong with a little car debate!

[MystroX5]

Originally Posted by mjr24

This whole conversation is pointless considering most X7's have air suspension and there is no actual M variant of the X7 (and no, the M50i and M60i are awesome but are NOT M cars in any way, shape, or form.....especially the suspension).

Not sure how this turned into a XB7 versus.....M8 (?) comparison? And then suddenly it was a B7 versus M8 comparison (the B7 would get smoked like a cheap cigarette BTW).

It wouldn’t be so controversial if BMW themself didn’t call them a “M” vehicle. BMW clearly made the classification statement from “M-Sport”, a design package to “M” on the back of the vehicle as a higher performance vehicles and qualified it for true “M” status rubbed many the wrong way. It is what it is and BMW gets to decide which cars are worthy of wearing the “M” logo on the back.

What is a proper or non proper M car is really for the manufacture to decide and BMW clearly has expanded its “M” qualifications across a wider idealistic performance view of what they consider a “M car” to be. If you want true performance exclusiveness, you’re gonna have to look offbrand from BMW. I think BMW M enthusiasts had to come to some palatable realization that there are now degrees of “M” vehicles manufactured by BMW or at least tell themselves that to maintain some acceptance to what the M division has done. This new M car classification was debated to death as it happened in 2020.
This is no different when BMW put a “M” on the back of a X5 and many at the time lost their mind that a SUV could even be a “M car”.
We will see what BMW does with the “ALPINA” badge now that they own it and it isn’t a separate design house.



“Enhanced performance and design, engineered by BMW M.”. That statement in BMW’s own build configuration put to rest any confusion on what BMW now considers a “M-car”.

[Young04]

Originally Posted by MystroX5

It wouldn’t be so controversial if BMW themself didn’t call them a “M” vehicle. BMW clearly made the classification statement from “M-Sport”, a design package to “M” on the back of the vehicle as a higher performance vehicles and qualified it for true “M” status rubbed many the wrong way. It is what it is and BMW gets to decide which cars are worthy of wearing the “M” logo on the back.

What is a proper or non proper M car is really for the manufacture to decide and BMW clearly has expanded its “M” qualifications across a wider idealistic performance view of what they consider a “M car” to be. If you want true performance exclusiveness, you’re gonna have to look offbrand from BMW. I think BMW M enthusiasts had to come to some palatable realization that there are now degrees of “M” vehicles manufactured by BMW or at least tell themselves that to maintain some acceptance to what the M division has done. This new M car classification was debated to death as it happened in 2020.
This is no different when BMW put a “M” on the back of a X5 and many at the time lost their mind that a SUV could even be a “M car”.
We will see what BMW does with the “ALPINA” badge now that they own it and it isn’t a separate design house.



“Enhanced performance and design, engineered by BMW M.”. That statement in BMW’s own build configuration put to rest any confusion on what BMW now considers a “M-car”.

I personally do not like how watered down BMW is making the M line (Merc is doing the same thing with the AMG cars...at least Audi keeps things somewhat separate with RS v. S). But you raise some good points. I will also add that BMW generally includes sales from their M performance vehicles when reporting sales of their M cars.

[MystroX5]

Originally Posted by Young04

I personally do not like how watered down BMW is making the M line (Merc is doing the same thing with the AMG cars...at least Audi keeps things somewhat separate with RS v. S). But you raise some good points. I will also add that BMW generally includes sales from their M performance vehicles when reporting sales of their M cars.

BMW as a brand, historically likes to live in the gray area of what they are and build. They build great production vehicles as “The Ultimate Driving Machine”. Then they modify to an extent these basic production vehicles with better suspension, brakes, and a bit more power as you go up the performance scale. As well as adding more luxury amenities creating a proper luxury vehicle within the same line.
They don’t build proper purpose all out sports cars or high performance cars from the ground up like other manufacturers do like Porsche or Ferrari.
BMW is a master at building GT cars that somewhat cross over in the sports car category as well as being a luxury touring vehicle. These cars give you the idea of both worlds making them easier to live with without the temperamental eccentricities of full out performance sports cars. That is the beauty of BMW and why they tend to be more driver focused than Audi or MB. That BMW “feel” or sharpness that is inherent even in their entry-level vehicles is from this performance/luxury compromise build principal.

[bimmerdiesel]

Originally Posted by MystroX5

“Enhanced performance and design, engineered by BMW M.”. That statement in BMW’s own build configuration put to rest any confusion on what BMW now considers a “M-car”.



[img] [...]

Off topic MystroX5 how did you source screenshots of 2021 model?

[MystroX5]

Originally Posted by bimmerdiesel

Off topic MystroX5 how did you source screenshots of 2021 model?

I have multiple screen shots from the beginning of the X5 G05 and then all new G07 X7 platform. I post them for reference over the years to keep some continuity of common topics that always pop up with newer members that might be just joining the BMW brand.
I am so ensconced with the G05 and G07 platform from that beginning even working with BMW’s technical advanced team with early iDrive 7 beta testing for firmware updates. I have all kinds of data points and screen shots from that. That was like a second occupation.