[Bmwfixerguy]

I searched and searched and the info overload is just too much to read through :/

Here is my mods list..
-Jb4g5 w/ nls
-catless dps
-Godspeed intercooler
-mmp inlets
- mmp outlets
2.3 gal meth setup w/ devils own 3 & 7 nozzles in the charge pipe
-charge pipe with goal bov
My question is what will/can I gain from a backend flash? What's it for and why would I do it?
Is it finer tuning than the jb4, is it for timing?
In a nut shell without flaming me what would someone like me want it for... I want it for more power

Also note I love in South Jersey with no e85 availability at all

[screaminfast]

Originally Posted by Bmwfixerguy

I searched and searched and the info overload is just too much to read through :/

Here is my mods list..
-Jb4g5 w/ nls
-catless dps
-Godspeed intercooler
-mmp inlets
- mmp outlets
2.3 gal meth setup w/ devils own 3 & 7 nozzles in the charge pipe
-charge pipe with goal bov
My question is what will/can I gain from a backend flash? What's it for and why would I do it?
Is it finer tuning than the jb4, is it for timing?
In a nut shell without flaming me what would someone like me want it for... I want it for more power

Also note I love in South Jersey with no e85 availability at all

Good list of mods. Even without e85 availability, you will want to run the jb4 pump backend flash. Switches timing, vanos, etc over to the DME.

[ritzzzzzwik]

^ +1 you want it for all that he stated.
Ever noticed that your JB4 sometimes behaves like an on/off switch?
Well Backend flash solves that. It controls a whole lot more parameters, and most importantly isnt fooling your ECU to raise boost. JB4 isnt all that dumb but essentially its a glorified boost controller. For better results, and smoothness you want flash. For best of both worlds- like smoothness of flash, and gauge hijacking ect of JB4. You stack em.

[Bmwfixerguy]

Originally Posted by screaminfast

Good list of mods. Even without e85 availability, you will want to run the jb4 pump backend flash. Switches timing, vanos, etc over to the DME.

Isn't there a more aggressive map for more power
Don't they have a race flash?

But thanks much for the reply.. In short yes it's worth it...

[talhagursoy]

Originally Posted by Bmwfixerguy

Isn't there a more aggressive map for more power
Don't they have a race flash?

But thanks much for the reply.. In short yes it's worth it...

You need a more aggressive map ? Go hire a tuner for $250 and ask him to set it for 30psi.

[ajsalida]

Originally Posted by Bmwfixerguy

Isn't there a more aggressive map for more power
Don't they have a race flash?

But thanks much for the reply.. In short yes it's worth it...

Yes there is a race flash for running with meth. Timing is more aggressive than pump flash among other things. In case you don't know there are 2 basic types of backend flashes where you run JB4 stacked. One is BMS and you need the Bavarian Tech cable. Cable does not need to be VIN-fixed to your car. Flash maps are free. The other is MHD, where you need the MHD app (but it is discounted, $79 IIRC) and you use MHD-specific maps created by BMS, which are also free.

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the MHD-BMS maps have access to more tables, esp for AT cars. I currently run Map 3 with the BMS race flash.

There are big stickied threads on each of these options over on N54tech.com. For the BMS flashes, you'll need to download some free software, all spelled out over there.

[CarAbuser]

Originally Posted by screaminfast

Good list of mods. Even without e85 availability, you will want to run the jb4 pump backend flash. Switches timing, vanos, etc over to the DME.

It doesn't switch anything over. The JB4 never controls timing and VANOS. Without the backend flash the DME is still controling those parameters, just incorrectly as the load reference of those tables in the DME will be incorrect.

[extreme-eg]

In summary yes you want to go the back-end flash route. Try the PUMP flash first for your ecu type and then log. Since you running meth, you can maybe run the RACE flash which runs more ignition advance.

Quite a few people have migrated over to MHD only, and removed their JB4's after experiencing the smoothness and consistency that the MHD flash offers - just some food for thought.

The JB4's trump card is the on-the fly map switching and gauge setup, running the back end flash kind of gives you the best of both worlds.

On MHD only you have the option of ACN/91/93/95 and E40 tunes

[screaminfast]

Originally Posted by CarAbuser

It doesn't switch anything over. The JB4 never controls timing and VANOS. Without the backend flash the DME is still controling those parameters, just incorrectly as the load reference of those tables in the DME will be incorrect.

Oh ok. I had thought that the JB4 was tricking those parameters as well.

Ask Terry.

[CarAbuser]

Originally Posted by screaminfast

Oh ok. I had thought that the JB4 was tricking those parameters as well.

The proceed could adjust timing I think, superior piggyback but just too expensive for most. The JB4 just fudges the boost.

[V8bait]

Originally Posted by ajsalida

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the MHD-BMS maps have access to more tables, esp for AT cars. I currently run Map 3 with the BMS race flash.

The bbflash (free) version is only lacking the ability to target very high boost (basically the cobb race code), MHD has that ability. It's a minor point for jb4 cars. There's a few other bugs with it but all of the new table discoveries apply to MHD, OFT and bbflash. Considering it's free, if you can find somebody with a bt cable it's a great option. The MHD custom logic (boost by gear etc) isn't very useful for jb4 cars.

[ajsalida]

Originally Posted by V8bait

The bbflash (free) version is only lacking the ability to target very high boost (basically the cobb race code), MHD has that ability. It's a minor point for jb4 cars. There's a few other bugs with it but all of the new table discoveries apply to MHD, OFT and bbflash. Considering it's free, if you can find somebody with a bt cable it's a great option. The MHD custom logic (boost by gear etc) isn't very useful for jb4 cars.

OK thanks this might help clear up something for me. I thought of the various BE flashes, only MHD-BMS backend flash was able to target higher loads for AT cars. Or none do it and you only get that with full MHD non-stacked JB4? Or all do it? As you know the documentation on some of this stuff is not exactly great.

This is probably moot for my present mods but before going big single should I ever do so I'd want to clear this up.

[Bmwfixerguy]

Thanks a lot guys it's all good stuff! Made up my mind to go pick up an OTG cable and use my buddies other cable and buy the jb4 back end race flash (that's what mhd reccomended) before the weekend probably

I will report back with my impression and butt dyno results

[Bmwfixerguy]

So just to be clear..
I have a Samsung otg cable
Bavarian technic (i think) K+ DCAN
And I have the app downloaded..

So the only thing I have left to buy is the bms/ jb4 race flash for 79 bucks right?

[ajsalida]

Originally Posted by Bmwfixerguy

So just to be clear..
I have a Samsung otg cable
Bavarian technic (i think) K+ DCAN
And I have the app downloaded..

So the only thing I have left to buy is the bms/ jb4 race flash for 79 bucks right?

I think you buy the special MHD-BMS app for $79 and then the BMS-MHD maps are all free. Read that thread over on N54tech. Maybe it's just semantics.

[Bmwfixerguy]

Originally Posted by ajsalida

I think you buy the special MHD-BMS app for $79 and then the BMS-MHD maps are all free. Read that thread over on N54tech. Maybe it's just semantics.

Oh wow that would be even better..

That thread scares me it's like 6000 posts long lmao

[screaminfast]

Originally Posted by ajsalida

I think you buy the special MHD-BMS app for $79 and then the BMS-MHD maps are all free. Read that thread over on N54tech. Maybe it's just semantics.

This is correct. $79 to flash JB4 backend flashes. BMS releases the backend flashes for free. Plus they're all unlocked, so you're free to open them up in Tuner Pro and modify things if you're into that.

[ajsalida]

Originally Posted by Bmwfixerguy

Oh wow that would be even better..

That thread scares me it's like 6000 posts long lmao

Just read the first page.

[V8bait]

Originally Posted by ajsalida

OK thanks this might help clear up something for me. I thought of the various BE flashes, only MHD-BMS backend flash was able to target higher loads for AT cars. Or none do it and you only get that with full MHD non-stacked JB4? Or all do it? As you know the documentation on some of this stuff is not exactly great.

This is probably moot for my present mods but before going big single should I ever do so I'd want to clear this up.

MHD is the only one that can keep the boost target high at high rpm on the flash side. If you're looking to run high boost flash only it's important, if you're using a jb4 it's only semi useful. The more power you're looking for the more useful it becomes though. On stock turbos bbflash is fine for backends, MHD for flash only or aftermarket turbos.

The bavtech cable is for bbflash only and it's expensive unless you can borrow one (all open source). The Cheap K+/DCAN cable with OTG and a compatible android device with single car license is for MHD.

[ajsalida]

Originally Posted by V8bait

MHD is the only one that can keep the boost target high at high rpm on the flash side. If you're looking to run high boost flash only it's important, if you're using a jb4 it's only semi useful. The more power you're looking for the more useful it becomes though. On stock turbos bbflash is fine for backends, MHD for flash only or aftermarket turbos.

The bavtech cable is for bbflash only and it's expensive unless you can borrow one (all open source). The Cheap K+/DCAN cable with OTG and a compatible android device with single car license is for MHD.

OK thanks. I'm already running JB4 + BMS meth + BB/BMSrace flash. Already had my own BT cable for doing diagnostics and such. Was wondering if it was worth it to switch over to MHD, sounds like it isn't.

[Bmwfixerguy]

So I did the mhd jb4 backend race flash... I'll be honest wasn't very noticable and or impressed :/

I saw there is 2 race flashes.. Did I do the wrong one ya think...