[JKen_0115]

Hi Guys, do have the experience for changing the BMC of K&N air filter that get more quicker or just sound a bit better? Or suggest to change the entire air intake, APE?

[BMW_M2_BE]

I have the BMC intake filter for replacing the original one. I don't really notice the difference. I still haven't hit 2000km so still driving with caution. Hopefully when I go above 4-5 thousand revs there will be a difference noticeable.

[rouxeny]

Pretty sure the vast majority of drop in air filters make no noticeable gains. Probably no consistently measurable ones either.....

[Robin_NL]

I'm a n00b at airfilters: Do they really help?



Cheers
Robin

[ORIGIN M.]

Yes

Check out this bad boy

http://www.bmwblog.com/2016/07/07/bm...arousel-195854

Originally Posted by Robin_NL

I'm a n00b at airfilters: Do they really help?



Cheers
Robin

[ried]

Originally Posted by Robin_NL

I'm a n00b at airfilters: Do they really help?



Cheers
Robin

A filter itself won't do anything. What's been referenced above is a cold air intake, and whether or not they have an effect is up for debate. When used in conjunction with a tune that accounts for the increased airflow and adjusts the fuel map accordingly, you can see performance gains - especially when coupled with a performance exhaust that helps move the increased volume of air away from the engine.

Be very skeptical about any claims of performance gains without a tune, however, much less with a simple air filter.

[Glounk]

The only real thing you get is more abrasive dust in the engine !!!!

[J.M]

Just got myself a K&N, will install it soon.

[NachoM]

Originally Posted by Glounk

The only real thing you get is more abrasive dust in the engine !!!!

I don't think its an issue for the majority of us.
Ive been consistently using BMC or K&N filters on all my cars for years and never had any issue with them. But I don't live in a very dusty area...

All tests from all manufacturers of these kind of filters show how well or bad they clean air from particles, which is something we simply don't know in paper filters. And it seems they do well...

Of course you need to keep them clean, but I prefer to clean them every 10K kms, rather on having a paper filter for 30/60K kms as the car manufacturers say.

The way I see it is they will not get visible benefits, but they are not doing anything wrong to your car, and no need to tune it, so if there is any benefit, even I don't notice, then I am fine. Same approach with oils...We all get crazy with getting the BEST oil, better than OEM...and we don't really know if there is a benefit there.

[Glounk]

Originally Posted by NachoM

I don't think its an issue for the majority of us.
Ive been consistently using BMC or K&N filters on all my cars for years and never had any issue with them. But I don't live in a very dusty area...

All tests from all manufacturers of these kind of filters show how well or bad they clean air from particles, which is something we simply don't know in paper filters. And it seems they do well...

Of course you need to keep them clean, but I prefer to clean them every 10K kms, rather on having a paper filter for 30/60K kms as the car manufacturers say.

The way I see it is they will not get visible benefits, but they are not doing anything wrong to your car, and no need to tune it, so if there is any benefit, even I don't notice, then I am fine. Same approach with oils...We all get crazy with getting the BEST oil, better than OEM...and we don't really know if there is a benefit there.

-Yes, in a dusty area like mine i keep changing the OEM filters every 20k, for peace of mind.
- For the high perf filters, what i can't understand is how more air you get in without getting more dust( silice dust is like diamond dust ) i guess the new generation oil we are using are doing the job to cover what dust is doing inside the engines !!!

[NachoM]

Originally Posted by Glounk

-Yes, in a dusty area like mine i keep changing the OEM filters every 20k, for peace of mind.
- For the high perf filters, what i can't understand is how more air you get in without getting more dust( silice dust is like diamond dust ) i guess the new generation oil we are using are doing the job to cover what dust is doing inside the engines !!!

Do you know what is the filter properties of the OEM filter??...I don't

I know at least what a BMC filter. And I can clean it as many times I want...

[Glounk]

I don't, you're right!!!!

[shemeld_135]

only think I noticed about the k&n filter I have is I can hear the turbo spool bit louder.

[nachob]

Originally Posted by Robin_NL

I'm a n00b at airfilters: Do they really help?



Cheers
Robin

They give you tiny boost at the expense of engine life. Not worth it. Replace paper element a little more often if you live in dusty area but look at the tests. They let more contaminants in and that is even when new much worse if you don't clean and re-oil properly. They are run in race cars because of short engine life. They are run in off road cars because they can cope with moisture better than paper but there is a reason they don't put them on street cars. The minuscule gains are not worth it.

[omasou]

Originally Posted by JKen_0115

Hi Guys, do have the experience for changing the BMC of K&N air filter that get more quicker or just sound a bit better? Or suggest to change the entire air intake, APE?

High airflow == less filtering

Only gain is increase in sound which is directly proportional to butt dyno performance improvements and a decrease in back pain related to a slimmer wallet

If you search hard enough you may find Jim's original article which was very detailed but I would still take it with a grain of salt b/c he used it to justify the foam filter, which BTW still uses oil. Also notice the date we have beating this topic to death for a long, long, time...

http://www.club3g.com/forum/3g-eclip...ly-better.html

[NachoM]

Originally Posted by masou

High airflow == less filtering

Only gain is increase in sound which is directly proportional to butt dyno performance improvements and a decrease in back pain related to a slimmer wallet

Could you elaborate about the less filtering??
Id like to have some clear facts on what a paper filter really "filter", and what a K&N or BMC kind of filters...we know they filter.

Maybe I am missing something, and there is some real measures out there on what each kind of filters really perform.

How also do you explain that some brands already have a BMC filter (f.e.) as OEM part?? Don't you think if they would offer less filtering (meaning I guess they would allow bad particles to get into the chambers...)...they would not be supplied as an OEM part??

[omasou]

Originally Posted by NachoM

Could you elaborate about the less filtering??
Id like to have some clear facts on what a paper filter really "filter", and what a K&N or BMC kind of filters...we know they filter.

Maybe I am missing something, and there is some real measures out there on what each kind of filters really perform.

How also do you explain that some brands already have a BMC filter (f.e.) as OEM part?? Don't you think if they would offer less filtering (meaning I guess they would allow bad particles to get into the chambers...)...they would not be supplied as an OEM part??

It's the same concept as your home furnace filter. The "cheap" ones that let all the deadly spores through have less surface area and "bigger" holes which BTW let the air flow better and is less stressful to the motor. As the filter gets dirty the "filtering" improves until the point where the filter is clogged.

The post above talks about some of this and remember race team need sponsors. The also take apart their engines and magnaflux them after each race, well at least PTG did or said they did.

See if you can find Jim's original post about filters.

BTW JC is a good guy and in no way am I trying to disparage him.

[NachoM]

Originally Posted by masou

It's the same concept as your home furnace filter. The "cheap" ones that let all the deadly spores through have less surface area and "bigger" holes which BTW let the air flow better and is less stressful to the motor. As the filter gets dirty the "filtering" improves until the point where the filter is clogged.

The post above talks about some of this and remember race team need sponsors. The also take apart their engines and magnafluxed (sp?) them after each race, well at least PTG did or said they did.

See if you can find Jim's original post about filters.

Thanks for the link...read it, also the K&N reply...

Again...K&N or BMC (or similar) report how they filter. tests they do...and how they do. You can believe it or not.
I have never seen any official statement of any paper OEM filter making clear their properties, or restuls in ISO tests.

Why then do I need to believe an PEM paper filter is better or more protective??
Yo don't know...


In any case none of my cars ever had an issue or had to clean the MAF sensors, after hundreds of thousands of kms...and Ive been on these kind of high flow oiled filters for many years. They work for me, in the area I live.

[omasou]

Originally Posted by NachoM

Thanks for the link...read it, also the K&N reply...

Again...K&N or BMC (or similar) report how they filter. tests they do...and how they do. You can believe it or not.
I have never seen any official statement of any paper OEM filter making clear their properties, or restuls in ISO tests.

Why then do I need to believe an PEM paper filter is better or more protective??
Yo don't know...

That's the point...all the "test" have marketing behind them. If BMW thought our cars need a foam filter, K&N, etc. they would design the engine with one. That and they realize people will not clean and oil the filter.

[NachoM]

Originally Posted by masou

That's the point...all the "test" have marketing behind them. If BMW thought our cars need a foam filter, K&N, etc. they would design the engine with one. That and they realize people will not clean and oil the filter.

Because they save money???....

OK...I leave this hear my friend. Maybe you don't need as well a "better" oil, a "better" braking lines, or pads, or fluids...as its all marketing and we are all stupid...

Maybe its all marketing behind an M2...and it is only one more marketing story than a real thing...

[omasou]

Originally Posted by NachoM

Because they save money???....

OK...I leave this hear my friend. Maybe you don't need as well a "better" oil, a "better" braking lines, or pads, or fluids...as its all marketing and we are all stupid...

Maybe its all marketing behind an M2...and it is only one more marketing story than a real thing...

I only said all the test that I have read are to prove why the person conducting the test has a better mouse trap and that I have not found to date an independent test quantifying a ROI on switching out the paper filter.

If you really want to loose your mind about filtering read this guy's web site for a few days, http://billpentz.com/woodworking/cyc...DustProperties

[FSociety]

BMC is top quality way better than K&N
AFE Pro Dry is also a good option.