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      12-19-2016, 03:04 PM   #1
kolosy
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Clutch vibration from a standstill

Here's a new one: when going from a stop, moderate acceleration (not a burnout, not a launch), in the last 10% of clutch pedal travel, there's a noticeable stutter / vibration, to the point where even a passenger feels it. Not the car lurching, but like there's something rattling in the clutch itself. Happens only on moderate power from N-1 and sometimes (less frequently) from 1-2.

Any ideas? It's at the shop right now, they're "unable to reproduce." When I told them it happens around 2500 rpm, the SA told me "well you're burning the clutch if you're at 2500 rpm"

... uh.. wat?
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      12-20-2016, 06:38 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kolosy View Post
Here's a new one: when going from a stop, moderate acceleration (not a burnout, not a launch), in the last 10% of clutch pedal travel, there's a noticeable stutter / vibration, to the point where even a passenger feels it. Not the car lurching, but like there's something rattling in the clutch itself. Happens only on moderate power from N-1 and sometimes (less frequently) from 1-2.

Any ideas? It's at the shop right now, they're "unable to reproduce." When I told them it happens around 2500 rpm, the SA told me "well you're burning the clutch if you're at 2500 rpm"

... uh.. wat?
Go out with a service member and show them what you mean if they 'can't reproduce'... these are expensive cars and I've experienced 'clutch judder' to some degree on most of my BMW's (moreso on my e90/92's) usually when cold. A mate of mine who knows his cars told me to demand they fit a new clutch! As for the comment 'you're burning the clutch at 2500 RPM' that's an ignorant comment from an ignorant person!!

Last edited by nozydog; 12-20-2016 at 06:53 AM..
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      12-21-2016, 12:36 PM   #3
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I can't blame the SA, your description sounds like you're partially depressing the clutch so it's not fully engaged while having the engine at 2.5k.

I get that you're saying that's not it, so the only way is to get a tech to feel it.
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      12-29-2016, 03:57 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by goj View Post
I can't blame the SA, your description sounds like you're partially depressing the clutch so it's not fully engaged while having the engine at 2.5k.

I get that you're saying that's not it, so the only way is to get a tech to feel it.
I simply read it that he's releasing the clutch at around 2500 (which is pretty normal) Clutch 'judder' has been an issue with the 3 series over the years (probably not just the 3, but I've never driven any other BMW)

OP, let us know what the dealer does to resolve please!
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      12-29-2016, 11:09 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nozydog View Post
As for the comment 'you're burning the clutch at 2500 RPM' that's an ignorant comment from an ignorant person!!
Since I'm also ignorant (assuming we are talking from a dead stop). it's not normal to slip the clutch at 2500RPM. Ideally you shouldn't even see the tach move from idle unless you need to move quickly.
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      01-03-2017, 05:29 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by eluded View Post
Since I'm also ignorant (assuming we are talking from a dead stop). it's not normal to slip the clutch at 2500RPM. Ideally you shouldn't even see the tach move from idle unless you need to move quickly.
Really!? So when you pull away (in a manual) you don't press the accelerator before you release the clutch???
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      01-20-2017, 10:11 AM   #7
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Just put it in 6th gear and lug it out at 600rpm around town. That is the best way to take care of your engine. If you can't feel a lurch every time the cylinders fire, then you might want to call your dealership and ask them about your turbo encabulator.
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      02-02-2017, 12:47 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kolosy View Post
Here's a new one: when going from a stop, moderate acceleration (not a burnout, not a launch), in the last 10% of clutch pedal travel, there's a noticeable stutter / vibration, to the point where even a passenger feels it. Not the car lurching, but like there's something rattling in the clutch itself. Happens only on moderate power from N-1 and sometimes (less frequently) from 1-2.

Any ideas? It's at the shop right now, they're "unable to reproduce." When I told them it happens around 2500 rpm, the SA told me "well you're burning the clutch if you're at 2500 rpm"

... uh.. wat?
Have you recently, or before this issue, did any "burn outs" or high rpm launches? Or, maybe even a downshift where you dropped down to too low of a gear and maybe "rode" the clutch to compensate?

Those are just questions to help explain what may have happened, not to indict you.

You may have "glazed" your clutch and/or flywheel.
This is similar to brake pedal "chatter/judder", it can feel like a light pulsation that has an oscillating quality to it. It feels that way because the brake disc rotates and where there might be some pad material build up the pad grabs, and as it passes that point the friction lightens, so as the driver is braking normally it feels like a light pulsation. Often this is mislabeled as "disc warp" or a "warped disc", when more likely it's a pad material build-up/glaze.

The same applies to the clutch and flywheel. Under certain conditions some of the clutch material can deposit unevenly on the flywheel, and the driver will feel it as a pulse or judder/chatter. Normally, it feels worse on take off, which is when the clutch first starts to contact the flywheel, and then it can happen between shifts depending on how quickly the driver shifts.
Also, this is mostly felt in 1st gear on take off and maybe the next gear. The feeling tends to not be felt once in 3rd gear or higher.

If this is the case, you can try to de-glaze this yourself simply by how you drive and apply the clutch.
Just to start with, simply drive normally for the next few days making sure to NOT "ride" the clutch, don't slip it too much especially during take off.
So, light rpm take offs, and quick shifts to the next gear. Over time and miles the parts should de-glaze naturally.

Another method is to take off from stand still in higher gear like 2nd, and don't over rev or ride the clutch. Just take off normally but in a higher gear.
Give it some time and some miles and see/feel if it helps.

If not, then there is always the dealer tech, but remember the clutch is a "wear" item, so make sure your warrant covers that or you may get charged.
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      02-03-2017, 02:24 AM   #9
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Lol wait... you're engaging 1st gear at around 2500 rpms? Unless you're launching the car, that should never be the case. Maybe only when I'm on a steep hill or trying to get up and going quickly from a dead stop, I'll never get above 1500 rpms at most before fully engaged in 1st gear. Almost never even above 1000 rpms if I'm driving normal on a flat surface. Not trying to knock you or anything, but that tech guy that told you you're burning the clutch isn't crazy at all. If you've been engaging 1st gear at around 2500 rpms for a while now, that is probably the cause of the problem you're experiencing.
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      02-04-2017, 11:40 PM   #10
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There is nothing wrong with engaging the gear at 2500 as long as its not an extended slip. People do much more damage launching their cars over and over than you're going to get from a moderate acceleration from a stand still with decent engagement without excessive slippage. If he's riding the clutch half engaged for too long and doing this routinely, then yes I can see how the clutch will be prematurely damaged/glazed.
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      02-05-2017, 03:45 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingleturboVert View Post
There is nothing wrong with engaging the gear at 2500 as long as its not an extended slip.
Again, I disagree. It's not normal to start off the line at 2500 RPM.

If you're struggling at driving your car off of the line without excessive RPMs. I might suggest the following. Go to the parking lot or whatever away from traffic. And start from a stop without using the gas pedal. Do this 10 or 20 or 30 times or as many as it takes. After that you can use the gas pedal again.
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      02-05-2017, 06:03 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eluded View Post
Again, I disagree. It's not normal to start off the line at 2500 RPM.

If you're struggling at driving your car off of the line without excessive RPMs. I might suggest the following. Go to the parking lot or whatever away from traffic. And start from a stop without using the gas pedal. Do this 10 or 20 or 30 times or as many as it takes. After that you can use the gas pedal again.
Since reading your posts I have been attempting to pull away using as little gas as possible and it's amazing how little you can get away with! So thanks for a great tip to help save fuel & clutch wear, mind you once my car is run in I'm not sure I'll be so restrained!
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      02-06-2017, 11:01 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eluded View Post
Again, I disagree. It's not normal to start off the line at 2500 RPM.

If you're struggling at driving your car off of the line without excessive RPMs. I might suggest the following. Go to the parking lot or whatever away from traffic. And start from a stop without using the gas pedal. Do this 10 or 20 or 30 times or as many as it takes. After that you can use the gas pedal again.
the internets make me laugh. my question was for "moderate acceleration," not "normal driving." that means i'm not burning it out, but i *am* getting on it a bit. it also doesn't mean i do this every time.

RPM90 this was a while ago, so I can't remember exactly. I don't really do launches or burnouts, but my wife drives the car on occasion and it's possible that she downshifted poorly (her 1 year of experience on stick vs my 18). thanks for the info, i'll give it a go.
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