[dleccord]

can you guys tell me what you think? new alignment is on the right.

at times, i feel the car isnt one piece when changing lanes at highway speeds. also, the steering isnt quite direct and somewhat driving without a front sway bar on.

left photo was before, and right photo is new alignment spec.

[Digitalize]

Toe in will numb the steering slightly as it adds straight line stability, and wants to self centre more.

It's bang on though, they've done a good job.

[Kgolf31]

That's a lot of front toe for our cars, IMO.

Personally, i'd prefer 0 toe up front. But that comes with its own positive and negatives.

Per BMW, that is correct. The fact you're coming from a 0 toe alignment up front is why you're noticing that difference

[Tim603]

I had a similar issue just after alignment. Turns out one of the ball joint nuts (front control arm to knuckle) was a tad bit loose causing a little bit of play in the wheel. After tightening this the steering firmed right up.

It may not be your problem but at least a place to start.

This DIY says the thrust arm ball joint nut should be 122 ft/lbs
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=778726

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Tim603

I had a similar issue just after alignment. Turns out one of the ball joint nuts (front control arm to knuckle) was a tad bit loose causing a little bit of play in the wheel. After tightening this the steering firmed right up.

It may not be your problem but at least a place to start.

This DIY says the thrust arm ball joint nut should be 122 ft/lbs
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=778726

That should not been touch for alignment. Why it was loose?

[juld0zer]

Perhaps new control arm or replaced bush? They are single use lock nuts.

OP, do you have adjustable strut tops? I notice your caster has changed and that can affect things a bit too

[dleccord]

Originally Posted by juld0zer

Perhaps new control arm or replaced bush? They are single use lock nuts.

OP, do you have adjustable strut tops? I notice your caster has changed and that can affect things a bit too

all stock. i installed m control arms and steering rack. is the difference in castor bad if both sides are different?

[007_e350]

I had a similar issue, turned out the Indy shops Alignment specs were different from the dealers, I walked straight into the bay where dealer techs were and they printed me out specs of the car w/o SAs involvement... anyhow, the Indy alignment specs made the car more lexusy, it would follow the road crown on hard breaking yada yada, couldn't stand it, ended up paying 175 to dealer and got the bimmer ride back, hope you sort this out it gets really annoying, our first world problems i.e lol

[dleccord]

Originally Posted by 007_e350

I had a similar issue, turned out the Indy shops Alignment specs were different from the dealers, I walked straight into the bay where dealer techs were and they printed me out specs of the car w/o SAs involvement... anyhow, the Indy alignment specs made the car more lexusy, it would follow the road crown on hard breaking yada yada, couldn't stand it, ended up paying 175 to dealer and got the bimmer ride back, hope you sort this out it gets really annoying, our first world problems i.e lol

thanks. it was the same indy shop that did my alignment. right off the bat; i think you hit home with the lexus feel. it's definitely not alive as before with the previous alignment specs, which felt natural to bmws.

[juld0zer]

0.6 degree difference isn't that much but it can contributr to your disappointment.
The M3 arms (assuming you did the upper (caster arm) and lower (banana) arms) should yield more camber. Yours has gone the other way?

[pruks]

Originally Posted by 007_e350

I had a similar issue, turned out the Indy shops Alignment specs were different from the dealers, I walked straight into the bay where dealer techs were and they printed me out specs of the car w/o SAs involvement... anyhow, the Indy alignment specs made the car more lexusy, it would follow the road crown on hard breaking yada yada, couldn't stand it, ended up paying 175 to dealer and got the bimmer ride back, hope you sort this out it gets really annoying, our first world problems i.e lol

Can you post the BMW specs for alignment or point me in the right direction please. I am going to get an alignment and want to compare the results to the BMW specs
Thanks!!

[bbnks2]

You guys are funny.

The indy gave you a more performance oriented alignment.


The dealer is going to give you more toe-in. More toe-in will provide for more straight line stability. Indy can give you the same if you knew what you were even looking at... go back and ask for factory alignment. Might as well remove those m3 arms and go back to stock camber too.

[dleccord]

Originally Posted by bbnks2

You guys are funny.

The indy gave you a more performance oriented alignment.


The dealer is going to give you more toe-in. More toe-in will provide for more straight line stability. Indy can give you the same if you knew what you were even looking at... go back and ask for factory alignment. Might as well remove those m3 arms and go back to stock camber too.

Let me ask you then which alignment photo shown in the original post would you choose for performance?

[Tim603]

Originally Posted by feuer

That should not been touch for alignment. Why it was loose?

Correct and your guess is as good as mine lol

[Kgolf31]

Originally Posted by dleccord

Let me ask you then which alignment photo shown in the original post would you choose for performance?

Upper left from front preferred alignment and bottom right for rear preferred alignment

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Alignment preference really depends on what you want out of it. The shop did put the alignment within spec.

Unless you told them specifics in your alignment request, they did it right.

[Will_460cs]

The factory specifications for Msport suspension are:

Front Axle
Total toe 0° 14'

Camber 33' which is .55°

Rear Axle
Total Toe .18'

camber 1 degree 50mins which is 1.83°

So I believe you have twice as much toe as BMW specs. I could be wrong on this as my interpretation of the TIS document.

Certainly I prefer Half the Toe you have and the tyres wear a lot better (particularly runlets which love to eat the inner edges). BUT THIS IS PERSONAL PREFERENCE.

[bbnks2]

Originally Posted by dleccord

Let me ask you then which alignment photo shown in the original post would you choose for performance?

I got lost in the replies about dealers and blah blah... I see now that you went from 0 toe to. 15* toein. I thought the opposite happened lol.

Definetly go back to the "before" settings. There was no need to align the car at all so they probably dialed in the toe back to green just so they could charge you. I'd go back and ask for both my money and my old alignment back lol

[dleccord]

Originally Posted by juld0zer

0.6 degree difference isn't that much but it can contributr to your disappointment.
The M3 arms (assuming you did the upper (caster arm) and lower (banana) arms) should yield more camber. Yours has gone the other way?

one more question, what are they adjusting in the alignment shop when they are changing the castor angle? is this the strut tower?

[Will_460cs]

Castor angle is changed slightly when adjusting the other settings, it won't be hugely affected and normally isn't measured accurately.

To measure castor the wheels have to be turned accurately to 15 or 20degrees in each direction and a calculation is done.

On a Hunter machine the calculation is automated but the turning of the steering wheels is not, hence the margin for error.


Did you see my comments about twice as much TOE as factory recommends?

[dleccord]

Originally Posted by Will_460cs

Castor angle is changed slightly when adjusting the other settings, it won't be hugely affected and normally isn't measured accurately.

To measure castor the wheels have to be turned accurately to 15 or 20degrees in each direction and a calculation is done.

On a Hunter machine the calculation is automated but the turning of the steering wheels is not, hence the margin for error.


Did you see my comments about twice as much TOE as factory recommends?

Yes I saw your comment about TOE. Alarming.

I think I hate the TOE-IN...I'll live with it until I put in new struts/springs in a month or two and get a better alignment then, hopefully tires aren't too bald then. I can't believe this much toe compared to zero toe makes this much difference. I don't think people will notice this unless they've driven both.

[dleccord]

Originally Posted by Kgolf31

Upper left from front preferred alignment and bottom right for rear preferred alignment

Thanks. Why did you prefer the rear alignment? Why is less toe on the rears better?