[LuisBoston]

So I went to check out the new A4 a few weeks ago, and after reading that manual transmissions were available on the car, the salesman told me they would not be available. As I was leaving, I made a comment to the effect of 'how can they compete with BMW if they don't offer a manual?' and he replied, "We don't have to compete, every review shows the Audi beating the BMW. There's no comparison.'

I thought, what an ass. Without a manual driving enthusiasts are being kicked in the nuts. How can Audi possibly compete with the "Ultimate Driving Machine" if a manual transmission is not an option?! And how can he make that comment? I walked out of that dealer so fast and got comfortably into my e90.

[Spool]

just turn the other cheek, don't let people like that get to you...there are other problems in life

[mroach]

Before I bought my E90 I was considering one of the new A4s, until I found out that they won't have MT until 2009. What an absolute joke. It's seriously hard to comprehend an Audi A4 not being available with anything but a slushbox. How far they've fallen...

Don't let the Audi guy get to you. He knows his cars can't be taken seriously by real drivers so he has to go on the offensive...

[TiAg335i]

I don't think the term "slushbox" is really relevant anymore in today's advanced automobiles, (namely, BMW, Audi, Mercedes).

[mapezzul]

BMW will soon follow suit. 90%+ of US consumers by autos, the new autos shift as fast as a manual and some are even more efficient MPG wise. Stick drivers are not the norm and you must also realize most race cars are not stick either. I drive a manual but I see the end near, while I will miss the connection to the car technology has improved things so much it is a moot point.

BMW did the same thing with the 5 series last year, there was a 6 month gap between auto and manual. When BMW designed the ///M5 and ///M6 V10 they never even considered a manual option, it was an SMG only situation; the US market is the only one than commanded the third pedal as we are stuck on it for "performance" though it is not the case. The manual in the EU is a sign of efficiency (and it is cheaper) but that should begin to dwindle over the next few years as people will see the new autos improve the MPG.

In the end the manual is on its way out and just how much time is left is anyones guess..... so this is not a surprise to me but I am open to something that is better.

[noro]

He is an audi salesman, he has to believe what he is selling is better. And the truth is Audi's are getting better at a faster pace than BMW.

[tpipta]

Could not agree anymore. Having that connection to the car is a priceless feeling but clearly with the available technologies today you are 100% correct in the fact that manuals will be a thing of the past. Probably sooner than later too.

Best,

Tony

Originally Posted by mapezzul

BMW will soon follow suit. 90%+ of US consumers by autos, the new autos shift as fast as a manual and some are even more efficient MPG wise. Stick drivers are not the norm and you must also realize most race cars are not stick either. I drive a manual but I see the end near, while I will miss the connection to the car technology has improved things so much it is a moot point.

BMW did the same thing with the 5 series last year, there was a 6 month gap between auto and manual. When BMW designed the ///M5 and ///M6 V10 they never even considered a manual option, it was an SMG only situation; the US market is the only one than commanded the third pedal as we are stuck on it for "performance" though it is not the case. The manual in the EU is a sign of efficiency (and it is cheaper) but that should begin to dwindle over the next few years as people will see the new autos improve the MPG.

In the end the manual is on its way out and just how much time is left is anyones guess..... so this is not a surprise to me but I am open to something that is better.

[Icy J]

Originally Posted by lem144

Without a manual driving enthusiasts are being kicked in the nuts.

I bet you that driving enthusiasts are hard to find out of how many cars BMW/Audi/Merc sell in total both in the US and around the world. I'm pretty sure that most people who buy these cars aren't buying it for the driving experience but rather the badge, and those who buy it for the badge rarely appreciate the car, only the logo.

[rob72]

Originally Posted by mapezzul

The manual in the EU is a sign of efficiency (and it is cheaper) but that should begin to dwindle over the next few years as people will see the new autos improve the MPG.

In the end the manual is on its way out and just how much time is left is anyones guess..... so this is not a surprise to me but I am open to something that is better.

Indeed, on the news I heard recently that now as much as 20% of new cars have an auto transmission, which is a significant increase.
Reasons being named where the drop in cost combined with the increase of traffic jams.

Still, you would not want to do your exam in a car with an auto gearbox, as it will be indicated on your license and you will not be allowed to drive anything else.

[noro]

Agree with all the comments about manual tranny evolution. If any of you had the pleasure of driving a true sequential manual (non-computerized) transmission, it is something else. No clutch needed to up shift, only needed to downshift. The fun factor is X2 times of the manual.

[darkcloud]

Originally Posted by rob72

Still, you would not want to do your exam in a car with an auto gearbox, as it will be indicated on your license and you will not be allowed to drive anything else.

That may be true in Europe but not here in the U.S., at least not yet. You can take your driving test in auto or manual and drive whatever you want afterwards. I took my original test 10 years ago in a manual and the test administrator never said anything about it, although he did enjoy the Jeep Wrangler with no top on a nice summer morning

[ragingclue]

It's good to know how to drive a manual, and can be a lot more fun as well. But for everyday rush hour driving and commuting... well... automatics offered in these cars aren't exactly what they used to be. Forever it was almost a rule of thumb that the auto had one less gear, the shifts were slow and came at inopportune times... they were much heavier... Not the case anymore. On my weekend car, manual for sure. But for everyday driving, the auto does the job without compromising anywhere near what it used to.

[pokerface]

nothing against you, but your comment on "how can Audi compete with BMW with automatics?" might be seen as a taunt and he let one back...

[Inzane]

Originally Posted by lem144

and he replied, "We don't have to compete, every review shows the Audi beating the BMW. There's no comparison.'

Huh... that's funny, because I can't recall ever reading a comparison article where an Audi actually beat a BMW... and I read a lot of car magazines.

[darkphantom]

Originally Posted by noro

He is an audi salesman, he has to believe what he is selling is better. And the truth is Audi's are getting better at a faster pace than BMW.

That is so very true...a few years ago I was looking at the 350z convertible and mentioned the E46 M3 to the sales guy....and he was like, "no sir, those vehicles have numerous electrical problems and poor build quality...japanese cars have much longer longevity and plus this is the 350z...bla bla bla....." I corrected him by properly restarting it was an M3....he shut his mouth

[ITLMOVE]

Originally Posted by pokerface

nothing against you, but your comment on "how can Audi compete with BMW with automatics?" might be seen as a taunt and he let one back...

Agreed. You make an attempt to bash the Audi and then get all butthurt when the saleman tries to defend the car he sells.

[freshwhite335]

[QUOTE=lem144;3524580] "We don't have to compete, every review shows the Audi beating the BMW. There's no comparison.'

QUOTE]

FALSE! when price isnt an issue [other wise the g35 usually takes it] the 335 is always the magazines first choice

[kronzprinz]

Originally Posted by lem144

"We don't have to compete, every review shows the Audi beating the BMW. There's no comparison.'

sounds like a desperate car salesman... with that attitude no wonder he's not selling...

[rob72]

Originally Posted by darkcloud

That may be true in Europe but not here in the U.S., at least not yet. You can take your driving test in auto or manual and drive whatever you want afterwards. I took my original test 10 years ago in a manual and the test administrator never said anything about it, although he did enjoy the Jeep Wrangler with no top on a nice summer morning

I know... I lived in the US for 5 years and had to get my license again since I could not transfer my European license. But compared to getting a European license it was a piece of cake. I just had to literately drive around the block and do a parallel park. I guess it took all of 5 minutes.

[darkphantom]

Originally Posted by rob72

I know... I lived in the US for 5 years and had to get my license again since I could not transfer my European license. But compared to getting a European license it was a piece of cake. I just had to literately drive around the block and do a parallel park. I guess it took all of 5 minutes.

I'm very annoyed by that...here in Texas, once you get your license, you don't have to do anything for the rest of your life. Just go on the internet to renew your license. No annual tests to ensure you still know how to drive...etc...

Europe has much more stringent laws...

[aut0sh0cker]

Originally Posted by noro

Agree with all the comments about manual tranny evolution. If any of you had the pleasure of driving a true sequential manual (non-computerized) transmission, it is something else. No clutch needed to up shift, only needed to downshift. The fun factor is X2 times of the manual.

And I do drive such a vehicle Very true that there is really no comparison to be made...

[dmboone25]

Personally, I would never get a car that wasn't MT, but it is definately a continuing trend for less and less stick shifts.....I just feel like I am much more engaged in the drive when I get to shift.....