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      02-05-2008, 10:07 PM   #1
GulagJ
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Procede and BMW warranty

Can anyone give me a definitive answer on whether the factory ECU has a way of logging max boost?

I've seen a number of people state that the factory ECU is not able to detect the Procede (as it's a piggyback) and make the inference that a factory warranty could still be used. This is all meaningless if anything on the car logs and stores boost values, however.

With this being marketed as a tuner-friendly car, it seems absurd that BMW would not add a device (or program the existing ECU) to detect a performance modification that could cost the company many thousands in warranty claims.

Thoughts?
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      02-05-2008, 10:12 PM   #2
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just spend the extra cash and get dinan. saves the headaches and worries.
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      02-05-2008, 10:13 PM   #3
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Here we go again.
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      02-05-2008, 10:19 PM   #4
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      02-05-2008, 10:30 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4th-n-1 View Post
just spend the extra cash and get dinan. saves the headaches and worries.
Exactly. I just dont trust these other guys just yet.
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      02-05-2008, 10:35 PM   #6
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egad!

i predict 10 more of these threads before the release date
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      02-05-2008, 10:42 PM   #7
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i've had my fair share of headaches with piggyback ecu's... i'm sticking to flashed ecu or in extreme circumstances, AEM EMS...
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      02-05-2008, 11:16 PM   #8
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How long has Dinan been doing an awesome job of tuning BMW's.....riiiight, I'll be going with dinan (props to Vishnu, just not enough R&D for me)

plz someone educate me if I am wrong
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      02-05-2008, 11:26 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ARES45 View Post
Here we go again.
Agreed. This sort of stuff is already old.

And the obligatory response to everyone who thinks tuning is dangerous, is don't do it. Around in circles we go again.

Tuning is a risk, no matter who the tuner is, just like track days are a risk. Folks making gut calls about which tune is more dangerous than any other tune on name-association alone, without any hard facts or hard evidence of failures to back anything up, tire the heck out of me.

Ugh.
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      02-05-2008, 11:38 PM   #10
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Any threads turning into tuner vs. tuner arguments will be closed and/or deleted. Please discuss these topics in a constructive and technical manner.
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      02-05-2008, 11:40 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1flydoc View Post
How long has Dinan been doing an awesome job of tuning BMW's.....riiiight, I'll be going with dinan (props to Vishnu, just not enough R&D for me)

plz someone educate me if I am wrong

BMW has been building BMW engines longer than anyone, and they still came up with M3 engines that failed and they had to put extended warrantees on them. And don't forget the Azuil (Asuil?) blocks in 540's that all had to be replaced. What a mess.

Everyone makes mistakes, no matter how many years they have working with engines. :iono:

I wouldn't include or exclude any company based on just what you mentioned alone.

I don't think comments like this actually help people get the best products into their hands. In fact, I think it just muddies the waters and feeds tuner-wars. Tuner wars suck.

Just say no to tuner wars.

(don't take it personal, I'm not attacking you, I'm attacking tuner wars)
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      02-05-2008, 11:53 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GulagJ View Post
Can anyone give me a definitive answer on whether the factory ECU has a way of logging max boost?

I've seen a number of people state that the factory ECU is not able to detect the Procede (as it's a piggyback) and make the inference that a factory warranty could still be used. This is all meaningless if anything on the car logs and stores boost values, however.

With this being marketed as a tuner-friendly car, it seems absurd that BMW would not add a device (or program the existing ECU) to detect a performance modification that could cost the company many thousands in warranty claims.

Thoughts?
I think the idea is that the ECU doesn't actually know how much boost is being achieved, because the piggyback unit is changing the input values going into and out of the ECU. The ECU is being gamed into thinking it is running within the stock boost/fuel maps, while the piggyback unit actually sends different messages to the engine. In theory the ECU would have no idea that the boost went above stock specs.

But only BWM really knows what their ECU is capable of logging. :iono:
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      02-06-2008, 01:14 AM   #13
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STOP IT. HASN'T THIS BEEN DISCUSSED ENOUGH! IF YOU WANT TO READ ABOUT IT GO BACK AND LOOK AT THE 50 OTHER DISCUSSIONS.
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      02-06-2008, 06:48 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdkind62 View Post
STOP IT. HASN'T THIS BEEN DISCUSSED ENOUGH! IF YOU WANT TO READ ABOUT IT GO BACK AND LOOK AT THE 50 OTHER DISCUSSIONS.
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      02-06-2008, 02:03 PM   #15
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Nixon,
Thanks very much for your posts - the only so far that had any thoughtful message behind them.

RDKIND62 (and other's who replied similarly),
I have been on this board since mid-last year and have yet to see any discussion of the various ways BMW could detect a warranty claim caused by an aftermarket modification. That is my question. Since it will take you as much time to point me to one of the "50" threads covering this topic as it did you reply to my message, how about doing me the favor and posting it up?

I'm not new to modifying cars, but am increasingly leery of where OEM's are going with warranty claims. 4 years ago a friend of mine had his warranty voided after a dealership service manager did an internet search and found he was involved in a driver's course. The repair work involved a defective electrical part, for what it's worth.

Regarding a tuner war - no interest in that. I'll make my own decision based on the experiences I have had to date and what I think is best for my application. I'd merely like to tap the community for any knowledge I might have missed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nixon View Post
I think the idea is that the ECU doesn't actually know how much boost is being achieved, because the piggyback unit is changing the input values going into and out of the ECU. The ECU is being gamed into thinking it is running within the stock boost/fuel maps, while the piggyback unit actually sends different messages to the engine. In theory the ECU would have no idea that the boost went above stock specs.

But only BWM really knows what their ECU is capable of logging. :iono:
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      02-06-2008, 04:39 PM   #16
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A BMW dealer tech on e90post posted that he could not detect the the PROcede (willing to bet any piggyback as well). Also Eugene(sic) on e90 had the same experience with another "friendly" bmw tech check.
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      02-06-2008, 05:46 PM   #17
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Toon me baby
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      02-07-2008, 06:00 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GulagJ View Post
Nixon,
Thanks very much for your posts - the only so far that had any thoughtful message behind them.

RDKIND62 (and other's who replied similarly),
I have been on this board since mid-last year and have yet to see any discussion of the various ways BMW could detect a warranty claim caused by an aftermarket modification. That is my question. Since it will take you as much time to point me to one of the "50" threads covering this topic as it did you reply to my message, how about doing me the favor and posting it up?

I'm not new to modifying cars, but am increasingly leery of where OEM's are going with warranty claims. 4 years ago a friend of mine had his warranty voided after a dealership service manager did an internet search and found he was involved in a driver's course. The repair work involved a defective electrical part, for what it's worth.

Regarding a tuner war - no interest in that. I'll make my own decision based on the experiences I have had to date and what I think is best for my application. I'd merely like to tap the community for any knowledge I might have missed.

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3984

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3517

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3335

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2787

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1803

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1802

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2258

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1461

this quick search found these in the last 3 months.
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      02-07-2008, 07:07 AM   #19
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I missed the posts in that thread that concerned "I have been on this board since mid-last year and have yet to see any discussion of the various ways BMW could detect a warranty claim caused by an aftermarket modification. That is my question. Since it will take you as much time to point me to one of the "50" threads covering this topic as it did you reply to my message, how about doing me the favor and posting it up?"

Or am I misunderstanding your intent?
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      02-07-2008, 07:15 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4th-n-1 View Post
just spend the extra cash and get dinan. saves the headaches and worries.
I agree. BMW isnt stupid. I have a buddy that works on EVO's. The dealerships always know if the car was reflashed or flashed back to normal. Like I said, BMW aint stupid.
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