JB+ Tune Detection-BMW Warranty Void?

Glassy · 06-09-2009, 04:12 AM

I wanted to get the JB+ for my E92 but was wondering if i installed it, if my cars computer system would store the tuner detecton codes so that BMW would be able to see them and possibly void my warranty?

Whats your guys take on this? Thanks.

Hampi · 06-09-2009, 04:33 AM

You might get this one to clear codes if it happens:
http://www.burgertuning.com/scanner.html

I left my JB+ in the car, when I brought it for inspectation. They had to do some minor warranty work: No probs! Same thing with my SSTT...

enrita · 06-09-2009, 04:39 AM

If you run it on Stock settings no. if you up the boost probably. BT tool is always a good investment.

Glassy · 06-09-2009, 05:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enrita

If you run it on Stock settings no. if you up the boost probably. BT tool is always a good investment.

if i run it on stock settings? as in, leave the blue dial on midpoint between min and max?

enrita · 06-09-2009, 05:52 AM

yes...why dont you search and read from all other people that have it installed?

0002s · 06-09-2009, 06:26 AM

Shadow codes can be thrown with any tune. SSTT/JB+ can both throw them, but are less likely to do so.

BT is your best bet to give you piece of mind.

lauer87 · 06-09-2009, 09:18 AM

Get a BT scan tool, seems like that's what most people with tunes/piggybacks have done.

vgame64 · 06-09-2009, 09:47 AM

In reality, when you are factoring the cost of any tune (except the CANbus V3), you should include the cost of the BavTech scanner.

They all toss codes, JB+ less likely especially at lower settings. The scanner is worth getting anyway for all the diagnostics is provides.

SV Concepts · 06-09-2009, 02:31 PM

It's illegal to void your warranty without proof that the aftermarket components caused the issue. Read: Magnusson Warranty Act.

Glassy · 06-09-2009, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jlevi SW

It's illegal to void your warranty without proof that the aftermarket components caused the issue. Read: Magnusson Warranty Act.

^
l
l

I like this..

smdandb2 · 06-09-2009, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jlevi SW

It's illegal to void your warranty without proof that the aftermarket components caused the issue. Read: Magnusson Warranty Act.

I love how that gets thrown around...

And when the turbos start whining or the HPFP acts strange BMW will claim that increasing the power over stock was the cause of the failure. They will have lawyers and professionals on hand to back up this claim.

Now, if you take your car in because the windows wont roll down then of course they can't decline warranty for that over a JB+. But, if they see it installed there is a high chance they will note it somewhere in the system and when you bring your car in for other service they may decline due to them noting the installation of a tuner device at a previous visit.

Are your wallets deeper than BMWs? If not, don't threaten them with meaningless bullshit like Magnusson Moss.

CYA, CYA baby. Cover your ass!

SV Concepts · 06-09-2009, 03:39 PM

You're 100% right. If your turbos fail and you are running a custom ECU tune your friend wrote... good luck buddy. Reflash your ECU to stock and PRAY - or just be honest (there's a novel idea). You knew the risk when you deviated from the approved software.

However, I had a problem with my steering wheel buttons and the dealer tried to tell me it was because of modifications - that's B.S.

My post was mainly concerned with the term "voiding the warranty" as if BMW were going to refuse ANY warranty service on your car. They cannot. They can only refuse to service things that have been modified... and even then, there must be proof that the damage was caused by your modifications. In many cases, there is no way to prove... but in the case of a HPFP (which is known to fail and can be proven faulty), don't worry about it, and enjoy your modification. Hell, even BMW is offering upgrade parts now.
JL

SV Concepts · 06-09-2009, 03:41 PM

Also, BMW of North America has little to do with this unless you try to go direct to them. Talking about their legal teams and deep pockets is completely out of left field, because it would never, ever come to that unless a component fails and takes someone's life, and even then, I'm not sure they would be held accountable (did legislation change after Nader's book Unsafe at Any Speed regarding Ford? Not sure)

Anyways... Dealerships are privately (and independently) owned. Most times, it is up to their discretion what they warranty and do not. The only thing that they are concerned about is if BMW will suspect, and then refuse to foot the bill. Most times, BMW just cuts the check (from my understanding)... but that's probably because dealers are overly cautious, and consumers are under-persistent. If my car has problems, and there is any shadow of a doubt that it is NOT because of modification, you best believe I demand to have diagnostics run. Ask the good people at East Bay BMW. Hate to say "told you so" - but my modifications did not and have not negatively impacted the car in any way. Sorry you guys had to file the claim. I know you didn't want to.

JL

JoeyFiasco · 06-09-2009, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hampi

You might get this one to clear codes if it happens:
http://www.burgertuning.com/scanner.html

I left my JB+ in the car, when I brought it for inspectation. They had to do some minor warranty work: No probs! Same thing with my SSTT...

you went from a SSTT to a JB+?

smdandb2 · 06-09-2009, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jlevi SW

You're 100% right. If your turbos fail and you are running a custom ECU tune your friend wrote... good luck buddy. Reflash your ECU to stock and PRAY - or just be honest (there's a novel idea). You knew the risk when you deviated from the approved software.

However, I had a problem with my steering wheel buttons and the dealer tried to tell me it was because of modifications - that's B.S.

My post was mainly concerned with the term "voiding the warranty" as if BMW were going to refuse ANY warranty service on your car. They cannot. They can only refuse to service things that have been modified... and even then, there must be proof that the damage was caused by your modifications. In many cases, there is no way to prove... but in the case of a HPFP (which is known to fail and can be proven faulty), don't worry about it, and enjoy your modification. Hell, even BMW is offering upgrade parts now.
JL

Alright, we are on the same page. I just felt the need to elaborate on what you said. Throwing the MM around because something powertrain broke while you were running more power than stock is BS.

Like I said, if your windows don't roll down with your JB+ then yeah the dealership better fix it. Apparently you had an issue with a dealership refusing service on an interior item... thats awesome!

You just kind of left what you said open to interpretation. If you go in there with a tuner box (or even one of these awesome flashes that throws tuner manip codes) and they notice it... you can expect damn near EVERYTHING powertrain to NOT be covered. If your trans gets a leak, the dealership says it was because of the tune making more power. Have a diff failure? More power! Its up to YOU to provide the burden of proof saying it wasnt your mod that caused it. That's where your pocketbook comes in to play. The dealership can play hardball, hopefully you are ready.

As for BMWNA, youre right. I was a bit off base there, but I wasnt really implying you would be going against BMW. More or less you would be going against a corporation (dealership) who probably has a bit more financial backing than you do. If you go in there with a JB3 and failed turbos and they decline the service... if you press the matter it quickly becomes something involving lawyers if thats your thing. Otherwise, you are paying for the new turbos and labor involved.

But you nailed it, people don't have the persistance to do that. So they will balk and pay whatever the dealer wants to fix it.

I'm just saying don't go in there touting the MM act unless you are ready to play. It's pretty simple to prove a JB3/+ didnt cause the windows to stop working. But proving the JB3/+ did not cause a premature turbo failure (or HPFP if they are assholes) is going to put the burden of proof on you. If they don't accept your proof, you are stuck with 2 options. Bend over, or lawyer time.

Back in the day of the bugeyes, Subaru tried to deny service on my WRX when the precat failed and destroyed the turbo. The reason? I had an aftermarket boost gauge. I just laughed my ass off for like an hour, and then called my friend (who worked at the dealership and was in to cars) and he took care of it for me.

Glassy · 06-09-2009, 10:00 PM

i just emailed terry from burgermotorsports and he said that leaving the JB+ at default settings will NOT throw up tuner detection codes in my cars computer system, so BMW will NOT be able to see it.

He also recommended taking it off before taking it into service, just so they dont see it and make note of it.

JayKay335i · 06-10-2009, 01:01 AM

Its true. Theres a 99% chance it wont throw a single code. But theres always that tiny slight chance that it can and I would say purchasing a BT tool or going to a shop with one and having everything cleared before dealer visits is better than losing your drivetrain warranty.

Glassy · 06-10-2009, 01:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayKay335i

Its true. Theres a 99% chance it wont throw a single code. But theres always that tiny slight chance that it can and I would say purchasing a BT tool or going to a shop with one and having everything cleared before dealer visits is better than losing your drivetrain warranty.

good point.. id ask you if you know of any shops to get everything cleared before taking my car into bmw but i just saw your in new york..

tomob63 · 06-10-2009, 06:44 PM

Simple cost/benefit matter to me...

I got in on the group buy for the JB+ today and went back later and bought the BT.
Just need the piece of mind. I'm running 2.33.3.0.1 so who knows how more complex the detection may be. We all hear on the '09's it's more detectable, so don't take chances.

Dan335i · 06-10-2009, 07:08 PM

My dealer is pretty much mod friendly,and i am friendly with the service manager and the techs.When i took my car in for a minor problem once (doesnt matter what it was) the techs told me dont bother to take out the SSTT and intake i have (BMS intake).Long story short the tech told me when he scanned the computer not one code showed up with the SSTT.I would assume that also goes with the JB+ as long as its not set up to 100% and is kept on the default setting.Even then if the JB was set up to the max he told me they wouldnt void the warranty unless something major went where BMW had to get involved,like sending a rep to check out,or ok the repair.Theres nothing like having a mod friendly dealership.

BillLee · 06-10-2009, 11:03 PM

^^lucky

JayKay335i · 06-11-2009, 01:35 AM

Mod friendly or not, take it out and clear codes. Just because he says dont take your sstt out doesnt mean if your tranny blows tomorrow they wont void your warranty. Better be safe then sorry. I'm trying to decide if I'll even leave an intake on going to the dealer. I'll probably put it back to stock for the visit.

06-09-2009, 04:12 AM	#1
Glassy E36, E46, E90, E92, F32 97 Rep 368 Posts Drives: G20 M340i Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Cali iTrader: (2)	JB+ Tune Detection-BMW Warranty Void? I wanted to get the JB+ for my E92 but was wondering if i installed it, if my cars computer system would store the tuner detecton codes so that BMW would be able to see them and possibly void my warranty? Whats your guys take on this? Thanks. Attached Images __________________
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06-09-2009, 04:33 AM	#2
Hampi Private First Class 3 Rep 197 Posts Drives: BMW Alpina B4S Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Switzerland iTrader: (0)	You might get this one to clear codes if it happens: http://www.burgertuning.com/scanner.html I left my JB+ in the car, when I brought it for inspectation. They had to do some minor warranty work: No probs! Same thing with my SSTT... __________________ Alpina B4S M8 Competition coming soon
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06-09-2009, 04:39 AM	#3
enrita Major General 161 Rep 7,377 Posts Drives: 335i - Big turbos Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Italian in Sweden iTrader: (0)	If you run it on Stock settings no. if you up the boost probably. BT tool is always a good investment. __________________ 07 335i AT - MOTIV 750 - MHD E85 BMS flash - BMS PI - JB4G5 - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - Helix IC - Snow Stg. 3 - Stett CP - Custom midpipes with 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - LUX H8 - Level 10 AT upgrade
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06-09-2009, 05:52 AM	#5
enrita Major General 161 Rep 7,377 Posts Drives: 335i - Big turbos Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Italian in Sweden iTrader: (0)	yes...why dont you search and read from all other people that have it installed? __________________ 07 335i AT - MOTIV 750 - MHD E85 BMS flash - BMS PI - JB4G5 - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - Helix IC - Snow Stg. 3 - Stett CP - Custom midpipes with 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - LUX H8 - Level 10 AT upgrade
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06-09-2009, 06:26 AM	#6
0002s Mein Führer! I can walk! 45 Rep 822 Posts Drives: Not a BMW Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Bunker iTrader: (0)	Shadow codes can be thrown with any tune. SSTT/JB+ can both throw them, but are less likely to do so. BT is your best bet to give you piece of mind.
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06-09-2009, 09:18 AM	#7
lauer87 Lieutenant 8 Rep 586 Posts Drives: 335xi Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: USA iTrader: (0)	Get a BT scan tool, seems like that's what most people with tunes/piggybacks have done.
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06-09-2009, 09:47 AM	#8
vgame64 Colonel 141 Rep 2,479 Posts Drives: BMW 335i Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: USA iTrader: (9)	In reality, when you are factoring the cost of any tune (except the CANbus V3), you should include the cost of the BavTech scanner. They all toss codes, JB+ less likely especially at lower settings. The scanner is worth getting anyway for all the diagnostics is provides.
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06-09-2009, 02:31 PM	#9
SV Concepts 361 Rep 5,859 Posts Drives: Vorsteiner E60 M5 Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: 1460 White Oaks Rd. Suite F. Campbell, CA 95008 iTrader: (10)	It's illegal to void your warranty without proof that the aftermarket components caused the issue. Read: Magnusson Warranty Act.
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06-09-2009, 03:39 PM	#12
SV Concepts 361 Rep 5,859 Posts Drives: Vorsteiner E60 M5 Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: 1460 White Oaks Rd. Suite F. Campbell, CA 95008 iTrader: (10)	You're 100% right. If your turbos fail and you are running a custom ECU tune your friend wrote... good luck buddy. Reflash your ECU to stock and PRAY - or just be honest (there's a novel idea). You knew the risk when you deviated from the approved software. However, I had a problem with my steering wheel buttons and the dealer tried to tell me it was because of modifications - that's B.S. My post was mainly concerned with the term "voiding the warranty" as if BMW were going to refuse ANY warranty service on your car. They cannot. They can only refuse to service things that have been modified... and even then, there must be proof that the damage was caused by your modifications. In many cases, there is no way to prove... but in the case of a HPFP (which is known to fail and can be proven faulty), don't worry about it, and enjoy your modification. Hell, even BMW is offering upgrade parts now. JL
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06-09-2009, 03:41 PM	#13
SV Concepts 361 Rep 5,859 Posts Drives: Vorsteiner E60 M5 Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: 1460 White Oaks Rd. Suite F. Campbell, CA 95008 iTrader: (10)	Also, BMW of North America has little to do with this unless you try to go direct to them. Talking about their legal teams and deep pockets is completely out of left field, because it would never, ever come to that unless a component fails and takes someone's life, and even then, I'm not sure they would be held accountable (did legislation change after Nader's book Unsafe at Any Speed regarding Ford? Not sure) Anyways... Dealerships are privately (and independently) owned. Most times, it is up to their discretion what they warranty and do not. The only thing that they are concerned about is if BMW will suspect, and then refuse to foot the bill. Most times, BMW just cuts the check (from my understanding)... but that's probably because dealers are overly cautious, and consumers are under-persistent. If my car has problems, and there is any shadow of a doubt that it is NOT because of modification, you best believe I demand to have diagnostics run. Ask the good people at East Bay BMW. Hate to say "told you so" - but my modifications did not and have not negatively impacted the car in any way. Sorry you guys had to file the claim. I know you didn't want to. JL
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06-09-2009, 10:00 PM	#16
Glassy E36, E46, E90, E92, F32 97 Rep 368 Posts Drives: G20 M340i Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Cali iTrader: (2)	i just emailed terry from burgermotorsports and he said that leaving the JB+ at default settings will NOT throw up tuner detection codes in my cars computer system, so BMW will NOT be able to see it. He also recommended taking it off before taking it into service, just so they dont see it and make note of it. __________________
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06-10-2009, 01:01 AM	#17
JayKay335i Banned 189 Rep 5,046 Posts Drives: ///M323 DCT Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: North Dakota; its best DUHHHHHH iTrader: (1)	Its true. Theres a 99% chance it wont throw a single code. But theres always that tiny slight chance that it can and I would say purchasing a BT tool or going to a shop with one and having everything cleared before dealer visits is better than losing your drivetrain warranty.
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06-10-2009, 06:44 PM	#19
tomob63 Captain 31 Rep 708 Posts Drives: 2015 335i Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Illinois iTrader: (14)	Simple cost/benefit matter to me... I got in on the group buy for the JB+ today and went back later and bought the BT. Just need the piece of mind. I'm running 2.33.3.0.1 so who knows how more complex the detection may be. We all hear on the '09's it's more detectable, so don't take chances.
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06-10-2009, 07:08 PM	#20
Dan335i Lieutenant Colonel 32 Rep 1,786 Posts Drives: 07 335i coupe 6MT,w/sp. pack. Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: orange county NY iTrader: (2)	My dealer is pretty much mod friendly,and i am friendly with the service manager and the techs.When i took my car in for a minor problem once (doesnt matter what it was) the techs told me dont bother to take out the SSTT and intake i have (BMS intake).Long story short the tech told me when he scanned the computer not one code showed up with the SSTT.I would assume that also goes with the JB+ as long as its not set up to 100% and is kept on the default setting.Even then if the JB was set up to the max he told me they wouldnt void the warranty unless something major went where BMW had to get involved,like sending a rep to check out,or ok the repair.Theres nothing like having a mod friendly dealership.
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06-10-2009, 11:03 PM	#21
BillLee Major General 679 Rep 5,382 Posts Drives: E92 M3 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: HTX iTrader: (21) Garage List 09 E92 M3 [9.00]	^^lucky __________________ Follow me on instagram: billy.by
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06-11-2009, 01:35 AM	#22
JayKay335i Banned 189 Rep 5,046 Posts Drives: ///M323 DCT Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: North Dakota; its best DUHHHHHH iTrader: (1)	Mod friendly or not, take it out and clear codes. Just because he says dont take your sstt out doesnt mean if your tranny blows tomorrow they wont void your warranty. Better be safe then sorry. I'm trying to decide if I'll even leave an intake on going to the dealer. I'll probably put it back to stock for the visit.
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