Two warning lights

davea300 · 08-13-2009, 03:58 PM

Ok had the 318i for one week, got 40K on the clock. According to the service history brake pads have never been changed. Today I got 2 warning lights appear on the dash, one is the parking brake light, it stays orange all the time and the other is a triangle with an arrow headed circle going round it and "!" next to it.

I checked the manual, park brake light refers to brake pads and the other one can refer to DTC/stability control. DTC doesn't come on anymore when I press the button.

I'm thinking the rear pads and sensor need changed and that's why the DTC light is on. Noticed the car slipped a bit when I applied the park brake on a hill the other day. Hoping the change of pads and sensor and of course a reset will fix. Any comments anyone?

zltm089 · 08-13-2009, 04:39 PM

Definitely rear pads issue, if the hand brake is not working properly...

xenon · 08-14-2009, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zltm089

Definitely rear pads issue, if the hand brake is not working properly...

Why? The brake pads have absolutely nothing to do with the handbrake, which works on shoes in the disc hub.

Sounds to me like the classic symptoms of a failed ABS wheel sensor. The pad wear warning is an amber (!).

kend · 08-14-2009, 02:01 AM

handbrake does not operate the rear pads, there is a totally independant system for the handbrake.

davea300 · 08-14-2009, 06:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xenon

Why? The brake pads have absolutely nothing to do with the handbrake, which works on shoes in the disc hub.

Sounds to me like the classic symptoms of a failed ABS wheel sensor. The pad wear warning is an amber (!).

Thanks for the replies. One of the lights on the dash is an amber (!) and the other is an amber warning triangle with a circular arrow round it. The amber (!) still turns red when I apply the hbrake. That's why I thought it was rear brake pads. Didn't know about the handbrake having separate shoes though, will have to check them as well.

Going to pour down here today but will check them as soon as I can. Pads haven't been replaced at all.

davea300 · 08-14-2009, 06:15 AM

Do the handbrake shoes have a wear down sensor???

xenon · 08-14-2009, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davea300

Do the handbrake shoes have a wear down sensor???

No. Unless you do lots of handbrake turns they won't wear down in the first place.

The warning triangle with the arrow is the DTC. You have a failed ABS wheel sensor, I'd put my mortgage on it.

davea300 · 08-14-2009, 06:49 AM

Just had a look at the rear pads. Lots of pad left on them and fluid level is fine. Discs have a lip of corrosion round the edge but nothing too bad so I'm thinking you could be right given that the DTC won't switch on anymore.

Expensive to replace ABS sensor?? Dealer only job?

xenon · 08-14-2009, 06:51 AM

I've only done the job on an e46 which was quite easy; I don't see the e9x being much different. If you can wield spanners you'll be OK. Sensor is about £60 but you need to know which one it is so you need to get the codes read.

davea300 · 08-14-2009, 07:40 AM

Thanks. Got a code reader so will check it later. No probs for me to do by myself.

davea300 · 08-14-2009, 08:37 AM

Just used the OBDII code reader, no codes showed up.... but if I hold down the BC button on the indicator stalk whilst each of the warning lights are on the dash these codes are displayed on the digital screen:

CC-ID 24
CC-ID 35

One is for the (!) sign and the other is for the sign with the triangle and circle round it.

I would have thought a faulty abs sensor would have shown up on the OBD reader (my code reader does work for this car, it picked up the VIN on it and found the correct type of codes to read).

xenon · 08-14-2009, 08:41 AM

Perhaps one of those codes indicates the sensor? I got the stealer to read mine and then replaced it myself.

davea300 · 08-14-2009, 08:46 AM

Just checked here:

https://wiki.bentleypublishers.com/display/tech/Check+Control+Message+Definitions+BMW+3-Series+E90+E91+E92+E93;jsessionid=9177D28002F12EE9 F24242A6C62198A5

Page 7 has the lights and codes I'm seeing, DSC failure.

Only had car 1 week! Going by the posts on other threads this is expensive.

xenon · 08-14-2009, 08:50 AM

A faulty ABS sensor causes the DSC to fail, but I don't know if the codes differentiate so it still could be a sensor. If your car is an 05-06 model then it could well be the DSC controller / pump. Lots failed on cars of that age and BMW seem to do 50% goodwill. There's a thread on here about it.

davea300 · 08-14-2009, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xenon

A faulty ABS sensor causes the DSC to fail, but I don't know if the codes differentiate so it still could be a sensor. If your car is an 05-06 model then it could well be the DSC controller / pump. Lots failed on cars of that age and BMW seem to do 50% goodwill. There's a thread on here about it.

Thanks for your help with this.

Just phoned the dealer I got the car from. I've got one months warranty that covers labour and parts. Someone is coming to pick the car up on Tuesday and take it to bmw. They seemed to know what the fault is so I'm guessing it's the common DSC fault mentioned in other threads. I even told them the codes.

xenon · 08-14-2009, 09:14 AM

Cool. As long as they don't fix it by taking the bulbs out

davea300 · 08-14-2009, 09:39 AM

Or duck tape!

milan_ns · 08-17-2009, 10:36 AM

DSC unit replacement is a £2k job.

My dealer was kind enough to do the job for £160 even though my car was out of warranty (but dealer maintained and low milage - '06 + 39k on the clock).

You may save couple of hundreds if you go to independent shop, but keep in mind that the part alone is £1250 + vat and has to be BMW sourced.

davea300 · 08-17-2009, 02:30 PM

I know! Very expensive part! I've only had the car 9 days and the dealer did say I had a months warranty on parts and labour. If indeed the dsc unit has failed (which I think it has) I'm hoping this is covered and gets replaced. If not I'll have one of the shortest bmw ownership experiences ever and getting a prompt refund and my trade in back. I refuse to pay a bill that size for any car I've owned for less than 2 weeks.

Going in 2moro, hope it works out because I love the car.

Dr Dave · 08-17-2009, 03:23 PM

I do hope this unit has been replaced on my car!

//worried!

davea300 · 08-18-2009, 04:33 PM

Well, it was the dsc unit that needed replaced. It was replaced today but they have to keep the car in to remap the ecu so I'll get it back 2moro. Bill was around £1500 but thankfully my warranty covered it. Pretty lucky for me it happened when it did!

wilky · 08-18-2009, 05:24 PM

Hi guys, I'm new on here and sorry to jump in but my lights have come on. The car is booked in at a dealers on Thursday and I'm guessing it'll be the pump etc. My car is only 3 months out of warranty with BMW but has a independant warranty (bet it's not covered) which would only cover £500. The car has 84k with main dealer (Dick Lovett, Swindon) service history. What are the chances of goodwill?

08-13-2009, 03:58 PM	#1
davea300 Private 9 Rep 64 Posts Drives: X3 2.0d Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Scotland iTrader: (0)	Two warning lights Ok had the 318i for one week, got 40K on the clock. According to the service history brake pads have never been changed. Today I got 2 warning lights appear on the dash, one is the parking brake light, it stays orange all the time and the other is a triangle with an arrow headed circle going round it and "!" next to it. I checked the manual, park brake light refers to brake pads and the other one can refer to DTC/stability control. DTC doesn't come on anymore when I press the button. I'm thinking the rear pads and sensor need changed and that's why the DTC light is on. Noticed the car slipped a bit when I applied the park brake on a hill the other day. Hoping the change of pads and sensor and of course a reset will fix. Any comments anyone?
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08-13-2009, 04:39 PM	#2
zltm089 Banned 243 Rep 7,690 Posts Drives: 335i SE Coupe Space Grey Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: LONDON iTrader: (0) Garage List 2006 BMW 335i [10.00]	Definitely rear pads issue, if the hand brake is not working properly...
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08-14-2009, 02:01 AM	#4
kend Second Lieutenant 15 Rep 295 Posts Drives: E93 330i SE auto Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: UK iTrader: (0)	handbrake does not operate the rear pads, there is a totally independant system for the handbrake.
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08-14-2009, 06:15 AM	#6
davea300 Private 9 Rep 64 Posts Drives: X3 2.0d Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Scotland iTrader: (0)	Do the handbrake shoes have a wear down sensor???
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08-14-2009, 06:49 AM	#8
davea300 Private 9 Rep 64 Posts Drives: X3 2.0d Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Scotland iTrader: (0)	Just had a look at the rear pads. Lots of pad left on them and fluid level is fine. Discs have a lip of corrosion round the edge but nothing too bad so I'm thinking you could be right given that the DTC won't switch on anymore. Expensive to replace ABS sensor?? Dealer only job?
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08-14-2009, 06:51 AM	#9
xenon Major General 1397 Rep 8,083 Posts Drives: 2021 G21 330i M-Sport Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Coventry iTrader: (0)	I've only done the job on an e46 which was quite easy; I don't see the e9x being much different. If you can wield spanners you'll be OK. Sensor is about £60 but you need to know which one it is so you need to get the codes read. __________________ Ian Current: 2021 G21 330i M-Sport Previous: 2018 A6 Avant S-Line MMI+, 2014 F31 320d M-Sport, 2013 F10 520d M-Sport, 2011 F10 530d M-Sport, 2008 320i M-Sport Coupe, 2002 325i, 2001 318i valvetronic, 1998 318i, 1996 525i, 1990 Porsche 944S2
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08-14-2009, 07:40 AM	#10
davea300 Private 9 Rep 64 Posts Drives: X3 2.0d Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Scotland iTrader: (0)	Thanks. Got a code reader so will check it later. No probs for me to do by myself.
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08-14-2009, 08:37 AM	#11
davea300 Private 9 Rep 64 Posts Drives: X3 2.0d Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Scotland iTrader: (0)	Just used the OBDII code reader, no codes showed up.... but if I hold down the BC button on the indicator stalk whilst each of the warning lights are on the dash these codes are displayed on the digital screen: CC-ID 24 CC-ID 35 One is for the (!) sign and the other is for the sign with the triangle and circle round it. I would have thought a faulty abs sensor would have shown up on the OBD reader (my code reader does work for this car, it picked up the VIN on it and found the correct type of codes to read).
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08-14-2009, 08:41 AM	#12
xenon Major General 1397 Rep 8,083 Posts Drives: 2021 G21 330i M-Sport Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Coventry iTrader: (0)	Perhaps one of those codes indicates the sensor? I got the stealer to read mine and then replaced it myself. __________________ Ian Current: 2021 G21 330i M-Sport Previous: 2018 A6 Avant S-Line MMI+, 2014 F31 320d M-Sport, 2013 F10 520d M-Sport, 2011 F10 530d M-Sport, 2008 320i M-Sport Coupe, 2002 325i, 2001 318i valvetronic, 1998 318i, 1996 525i, 1990 Porsche 944S2
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08-14-2009, 08:46 AM	#13
davea300 Private 9 Rep 64 Posts Drives: X3 2.0d Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Scotland iTrader: (0)	Just checked here: https://wiki.bentleypublishers.com/display/tech/Check+Control+Message+Definitions+BMW+3-Series+E90+E91+E92+E93;jsessionid=9177D28002F12EE9 F24242A6C62198A5 Page 7 has the lights and codes I'm seeing, DSC failure. Only had car 1 week! Going by the posts on other threads this is expensive.
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08-14-2009, 08:50 AM	#14
xenon Major General 1397 Rep 8,083 Posts Drives: 2021 G21 330i M-Sport Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Coventry iTrader: (0)	A faulty ABS sensor causes the DSC to fail, but I don't know if the codes differentiate so it still could be a sensor. If your car is an 05-06 model then it could well be the DSC controller / pump. Lots failed on cars of that age and BMW seem to do 50% goodwill. There's a thread on here about it. __________________ Ian Current: 2021 G21 330i M-Sport Previous: 2018 A6 Avant S-Line MMI+, 2014 F31 320d M-Sport, 2013 F10 520d M-Sport, 2011 F10 530d M-Sport, 2008 320i M-Sport Coupe, 2002 325i, 2001 318i valvetronic, 1998 318i, 1996 525i, 1990 Porsche 944S2
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08-14-2009, 09:14 AM	#16
xenon Major General 1397 Rep 8,083 Posts Drives: 2021 G21 330i M-Sport Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Coventry iTrader: (0)	Cool. As long as they don't fix it by taking the bulbs out __________________ Ian Current: 2021 G21 330i M-Sport Previous: 2018 A6 Avant S-Line MMI+, 2014 F31 320d M-Sport, 2013 F10 520d M-Sport, 2011 F10 530d M-Sport, 2008 320i M-Sport Coupe, 2002 325i, 2001 318i valvetronic, 1998 318i, 1996 525i, 1990 Porsche 944S2
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08-14-2009, 09:39 AM	#17
davea300 Private 9 Rep 64 Posts Drives: X3 2.0d Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Scotland iTrader: (0)	Or duck tape!
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08-17-2009, 10:36 AM	#18
milan_ns New Member 2 Rep 21 Posts Drives: E90 320i Join Date: May 2009 Location: London iTrader: (0)	DSC unit replacement is a £2k job. My dealer was kind enough to do the job for £160 even though my car was out of warranty (but dealer maintained and low milage - '06 + 39k on the clock). You may save couple of hundreds if you go to independent shop, but keep in mind that the part alone is £1250 + vat and has to be BMW sourced.
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08-17-2009, 02:30 PM	#19
davea300 Private 9 Rep 64 Posts Drives: X3 2.0d Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Scotland iTrader: (0)	I know! Very expensive part! I've only had the car 9 days and the dealer did say I had a months warranty on parts and labour. If indeed the dsc unit has failed (which I think it has) I'm hoping this is covered and gets replaced. If not I'll have one of the shortest bmw ownership experiences ever and getting a prompt refund and my trade in back. I refuse to pay a bill that size for any car I've owned for less than 2 weeks. Going in 2moro, hope it works out because I love the car.
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08-17-2009, 03:23 PM	#20
Dr Dave Zummerzet Zyder Drinker! 112 Rep 5,541 Posts Drives: '06 330D Le Mans Blue Join Date: May 2009 Location: Somerset iTrader: (3) Garage List 2006 330d M Sport [0.00]	I do hope this unit has been replaced on my car! //worried! __________________
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08-18-2009, 04:33 PM	#21
davea300 Private 9 Rep 64 Posts Drives: X3 2.0d Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Scotland iTrader: (0)	Well, it was the dsc unit that needed replaced. It was replaced today but they have to keep the car in to remap the ecu so I'll get it back 2moro. Bill was around £1500 but thankfully my warranty covered it. Pretty lucky for me it happened when it did!
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08-18-2009, 05:24 PM	#22
wilky New Member 1 Rep 27 Posts Drives: E90 320D MSport Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Sheffield iTrader: (0)	Hi guys, I'm new on here and sorry to jump in but my lights have come on. The car is booked in at a dealers on Thursday and I'm guessing it'll be the pump etc. My car is only 3 months out of warranty with BMW but has a independant warranty (bet it's not covered) which would only cover £500. The car has 84k with main dealer (Dick Lovett, Swindon) service history. What are the chances of goodwill?
	Appreciate 0 Quote