[OpenFlash]

Hi guys,
One of the features that we've been considering for a while is a performance oriented traction control. Basically, something useful for those who routinely drive around with DTC completely off (pressed held for 5 sec). The function of it would be pretty straight forward:

The PROcede would monitor wheel slip under acceleration and adjust boost and timing to reduce torque when appropriate. With the goal being to sustain *very mild* wheelspin which is ideal for maximum acceleration. The "problem" now is that there is so much instant torque when the throttle goes down that it's easy to spin the tires through 1st, 2nd and half of 3rd when conditions are favorable (for power).

The difference between this proposed feature and the factory DTC feature is that we don't simply close the throttle and discharge all the boost when wheels slip occurs. We would physically maintain ~60-80% of the boost the entire time and adjust torque through instantaneous ignition advance offset which can be implied and removed instantly without any effect on turbo lag and boost response.

With what we've achieved with the new Throttle Delay Fix logic, implementing this shouldn't take very long. And we could even make the settings adjustable and gear-dependent. Think of it as a next generation Traction Nanny. A few steps ahead of the current gear-dependent boost control user adjustables that we currently offer.

How does that sound?

[Ironring Racing]

YES!

Well actually what I really want is a way to permanently defeat TC. I'm tired of holding the button for 5 sec everytime I get in the car. I actually called your shop a couple months ago to ask if this was possible and they said the Proceed doesn't tap into the Traction Control Unit and so it wasn't. I guess that's changed.

Ideally if it would just remember the last setting (i.e. full off), I'd be happy with that. Or if you could adjust the % on your proposed Performance Traction to maintain 100% of the boost (i.e. no intervention-full traction off), and it would remember it's last state, that would be ideal, and would solve all the complaints around using the TC button for map switching.

Looking forward to it!

[bestsw20]

This sound really good!!! I have too much power when shifting with the new beta map!!

[Sniz]

Originally Posted by bestsw20

This sound really good!!! I have too much power when shifting with the new beta map!!

thats a great problem to have

[TheAcAvenger]

hahaahaha, this is great.

Who needs a dsc module?!

[Alex@AKMotorwerk]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Hi guys,
One of the features that we've been considering for a while is a performance oriented traction control. Basically, something useful for those who routinely drive around with DTC completely off (pressed held for 5 sec). The function of it would be pretty straight forward:

The PROcede would monitor wheel slip under acceleration and adjust boost and timing to reduce torque when appropriate. With the goal being to sustain *very mild* wheelspin which is ideal for maximum acceleration. The "problem" now is that there is so much instant torque when the throttle goes down that it's easy to spin the tires through 1st, 2nd and half of 3rd when conditions are favorable (for power).

The difference between this proposed feature and the factory DTC feature is that we don't simply close the throttle and discharge all the boost when wheels slip occurs. We would physically maintain ~60-80% of the boost the entire time and adjust torque through instantaneous ignition advance offset which can be implied and removed instantly without any effect on turbo lag and boost response.

With what we've achieved with the new Throttle Delay Fix logic, implementing this shouldn't take very long. And we could even make the settings adjustable and gear-dependent. Think of it as a next generation Traction Nanny. A few steps ahead of the current gear-dependent boost control user adjustables that we currently offer.

How does that sound?

i would love to test this out... tires spin all the way threw 1st and 2nd with the new beta maps

[FotiosF90M5]

I think its a great idea. bring it on.

[Highflyr]

Originally Posted by Ironring Racing

YES!

Well actually what I really want is a way to permanently defeat TC. I'm tired of holding the button for 5 sec everytime I get in the car. I actually called your shop a couple months ago to ask if this was possible and they said the Proceed doesn't tap into the Traction Control Unit and so it wasn't. I guess that's changed.

Ideally if it would just remember the last setting (i.e. full off), I'd be happy with that. Or if you could adjust the % on your proposed Performance Traction to maintain 100% of the boost (i.e. no intervention-full traction off), and it would remember it's last state, that would be ideal, and would solve all the complaints around using the TC button for map switching.

Looking forward to it!

Sounds to me like you would still need to disable DTC, then the Procede takes over TC. Still sounds like the Procede has nothing to do with disabling DTC automatically. Did you even read shiv's post?

I'm all for this as long as it's added to the user adjustable menu with an on/off function. I like DTC sometimes in the rain. Saved my ass a few times.

[edo]

I would be interested if it was proved to actually make acceleration better (on dry raod, 275 tyres and lsd traction is not such a big issue) and if it was user selectable feature (maybe for different maps). Sometimes I want to go sideways and this feature would be a problem if it wasn't user selectable.

[Borsig]

only if user selectable, if so then yes....

launch control shiv?

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by Borsig

only if user selectable, if so then yes....

launch control shiv?

Yes, it would be user selectable and probably adjustable as well.

What we are proposing is effectively a n54 version of launch control. The traditional form of launch control (with 2 step rev limit) just wont work with the n54 which has the problem of spooling up *too quickly* and smoking the tires. Adding a 2 step will just make it worse.

Shiv

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by Ironring Racing

YES!

Well actually what I really want is a way to permanently defeat TC. I'm tired of holding the button for 5 sec everytime I get in the car. I actually called your shop a couple months ago to ask if this was possible and they said the Proceed doesn't tap into the Traction Control Unit and so it wasn't. I guess that's changed.

Ideally if it would just remember the last setting (i.e. full off), I'd be happy with that. Or if you could adjust the % on your proposed Performance Traction to maintain 100% of the boost (i.e. no intervention-full traction off), and it would remember it's last state, that would be ideal, and would solve all the complaints around using the TC button for map switching.

Looking forward to it!

It's unlikely that we are going to touch the actual DTC function for liability reasons. Not to mention that it already works pretty well if traction is your only priority (not performance). So our "performance" traction control would only intervene when DTC if fully OFF.

shiv

[Borsig]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

It's unlikely that we are going to touch the actual DTC function for liability reasons. Not to mention that it already works pretty well if traction is your only priority (not performance). So our "performance" traction control would only intervene when DTC if fully OFF.

shiv

+1 I would want an unmodified DTC for rainy crappy drives, abd weather, daily driving etc.

[Sparky66]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Yes, it would be user selectable and probably adjustable as well.

What we are proposing is effectively a n54 version of launch control.
Shiv

Shiv this is great

Having the ability to enable/disable this feature via the Procede User software and then making it adjustable so you can ideally customise and dial it in to your car, is just insane.

Of note; There will be times when turning off DTC/DSC, that some people will want to have the OEM setup. With this in mind, what would make this incredible is........... if one puts it in DTC disable mode and then you programme a steering wheel button via CANbus to activate Launch Control. Obviously, safeguards would have to be implemented to stop people accidently pressing the button at anything but from a standstill.
Go Shiv...

[Borsig]

yeah good idea....

I dont use half the buttons on my wheel cause i have no CD changer, nor idrive with voice.

[stressdoc]

Man, all this 'control of wheelspin in 1st, 2nd & 3rd gears...' reminds me of the Viagra commercials where they warn you to call your doc if you get an erection lasting more than four hours...

And where is the fourth option for the poll: No, I love to smoke my $300 rfts into oblivion!

[TurboSid]

good idea.

i'd be down for this

[TurboSid]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Yes, it would be user selectable and probably adjustable as well.

What we are proposing is effectively a n54 version of launch control. The traditional form of launch control (with 2 step rev limit) just wont work with the n54 which has the problem of spooling up *too quickly* and smoking the tires. Adding a 2 step will just make it worse.

Shiv

so how do cars like the gtr do it? they make more power than the 335i yet they benefit from the more traditional style of launch control with the driver being able to build some sustained form of boost from a dead stop....

not to mention all of the modified turbo cars out there with aftermarket 2 steps

[Sparky66]

Originally Posted by Borsig

yeah good idea....

I dont use half the buttons on my wheel cause i have no CD changer, nor idrive with voice.

Ideally the button should be close at hand at the Steering Wheel for optimal launches.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by TurboSid

so how do cars like the gtr do it? they make more power than the 335i yet they benefit from the more traditional style of launch control with the driver being able to build some sustained form of boost from a dead stop....

not to mention all of the modified turbo cars out there with aftermarket 2 steps

GTRs have all wheel drive so the tires don't light up uncontrollably in smoke

shiv

[lamia2super]

I don't really mind because I like driving around with the dtc off. if your having trouble controlling the car, which is hard without a lsd, learn how to work with it. I think that's the fun thing about driving cars each one acts differently and you have to tame the thing and learn how to drive it.

[Balzz]

Whoa...this would get me to switch to Procede.