Pure Meth

Htown09 · 01-12-2010, 05:35 PM

I talked to a guy at a raceshop today about M3, and M5. (VP racing Meth)

It is about 6.75 a gal. for M3 and 7 for M5.

Has anyone tested running pure Meth + 93octane. Would it be beneficial to run pure Meth or a higher mixture of Meth than a 50/50. Maybe you could a higher map on pure meth than a mixture.

Terrance28 · 01-12-2010, 05:50 PM

I wouldn't run pure meth its very flammable. Besides I don't think you will yield any more gains running 100% vs 60/40 or so. I also get meth here at $4 a gallon.

scottp999 · 01-12-2010, 06:31 PM

Be careful M3 and M5 have additives for cars that run meth as the main fuel, not an injection kit like we are using. Stick with M1 which has no additives (So you don't destroy your injection pump early).

Htown09 · 01-12-2010, 06:38 PM

I was told that you need lube that M1 does not have. And M3 and M5 already have it added.

scottp999 · 01-12-2010, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Htown09

I was told that you need lube that M1 does not have. And M3 and M5 already have it added.

No lube is needed. No additives are needed, just methyl alcohol and distilled water.

scottp999 · 01-12-2010, 06:54 PM

Take a look at this thread: http://forums.evolutionm.net/water-a...-methanol.html

scottp999 · 01-12-2010, 07:25 PM

Found these statements over on srt-4 forums as well:

Aquamist has found that the additive in VP M5 will cause premature seal failures in the Shurflo pumps as well as our flow sensors.

Given that, M5 WILL make more power over M1

For warranty purposes and in regards to 100% methanol injection, Aquamist users are advised to try and use the purest methanol available and methanol that does not have additives. VP-M1 meets these requirements.

---------------------------------------------

To be clear, using the methanol's available from VP as an example, everyone needs to understand that there's additives in all of them with the exception of M1.

It's the additives that will attack the seals of the Surflo pumps, and over time the pumps will leak as a result. The situation of pump failures due to using methanol versus a mix is not unique to one kit maker.

Also, when buying methanol buy the factory sealed (unopened) 5 gal pals of VP M1 or methanol equivalent to VP M1. VP M1 is about the purest methanol (no additives) that can be easily obtained by most people.

qwks6 · 01-12-2010, 08:18 PM

us in the turbo buick community run pure meth with great success. We say why run 50/50 except for a pump and nozzle that aren't set up for pure meth. But tuning this engine is very new, the turbo buicks have a 20 year advantage in testing and experimenting. Water doesn't add power. It helps suppress knock, but not better than meth. What you run really depends on your setup.

O-cha · 01-12-2010, 08:33 PM

Scott, its the m5 only that causes trouble, m3 is only m1 with m2 lubrication added. The m2 lubrication does not damage seals, it protects seals. It also lubricates surfaces like valve guides which a direct injection engine that has no fuel flowing past the valves could most definitely benefit from.

Htown09 · 01-12-2010, 08:55 PM

So M3 is good to use? But in coolingmist and snow kit's since we are using injection system and pump's, is running pure meth and pump gas recommended?

scottp999 · 01-12-2010, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Htown09

So M3 is good to use? But in coolingmist and snow kit's since we are using injection system and pump's, is running pure meth and pump gas recommended?

If I were you, I would PM or email the manufacturer of the system you want to use, just to confirm their thoughts.

scottp999 · 01-12-2010, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O-cha

Scott, its the m5 only that causes trouble, m3 is only m1 with m2 lubrication added. The m2 lubrication does not damage seals, it protects seals. It also lubricates surfaces like valve guides which a direct injection engine that has no fuel flowing past the valves could most definitely benefit from.

Thanks for the info!

Htown09 · 01-12-2010, 10:17 PM

If Coolingmist is listening, will we notice a difference in power by running pure M3 and 93 octane pump gas versus a mixture of meth/water and 93 pump gas? In other words, would we be able to run a higher race map with the pure m3/93 than we would utilizing the m3/water/93 mixture?

coolingmist · 01-12-2010, 10:17 PM

its been our experience from our customers that M1 is the only one to use, no additives should be used. We have cases of M3 causing damage to seals, I am not familiar with the others. The pump does not need any lubrication. Any kind of hydro-carbon will kill the pump seals.

CM

Htown09 · 01-12-2010, 10:19 PM

Ok so M1 is the one to purchase. Have you any info on running pure M1 vs. M1/water mix. Any testing done using pure M1 or M1/water mixture..

coolingmist · 01-12-2010, 10:21 PM

I like running water with meth, however many like 100% meth. I hate to break the bad news, but for everyone that says pure meth is best, there are those that say 50/50 is better.

I like some water because its better for preventing detonation IMHO. Again, thats my opinion.

CM

BoostedCosta · 01-12-2010, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolingmist

I like running water with meth, however many like 100% meth. I hate to break the bad news, but for everyone that says pure meth is best, there are those that say 50/50 is better.

I like some water because its better for preventing detonation IMHO. Again, thats my opinion.

CM

i beg to differ
100 meth is bettter

Htown09 · 01-12-2010, 10:36 PM

[QUOTE=335i82108;6514959]i beg to differ
100 meth is bettter[/QUOTE

What is your reason? You can't just state something and leave it at that. Have you run higher race maps with pure meth and no detonation and made more power than 50/50?

coolingmist · 01-12-2010, 10:39 PM

I like 100% water as well.

Like I said, asking this question is almost pointless. You will get a different response from everyone.

CM

BoostedCosta · 01-12-2010, 10:42 PM

well i dont know about our cars but someone tested 100% meth and meth mix and it turned out that 100 was actually better
http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...-50-mix-42915/

Htown09 · 01-12-2010, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolingmist

I like 100% water as well.

Like I said, asking this question is almost pointless. You will get a different response from everyone.

CM

Distilled water I assume?

Htown09 · 01-12-2010, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolingmist

I like running water with meth, however many like 100% meth. I hate to break the bad news, but for everyone that says pure meth is best, there are those that say 50/50 is better.

I like some water because its better for preventing detonation IMHO. Again, thats my opinion.

CM

So your kit can pump 100% Meth? I was looking at DO kit and it say's up to 50% Meth.

01-12-2010, 05:35 PM	#1
Htown09 Captain 44 Rep 783 Posts Drives: E92 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Earth iTrader: (3)	Pure Meth I talked to a guy at a raceshop today about M3, and M5. (VP racing Meth) It is about 6.75 a gal. for M3 and 7 for M5. Has anyone tested running pure Meth + 93octane. Would it be beneficial to run pure Meth or a higher mixture of Meth than a 50/50. Maybe you could a higher map on pure meth than a mixture.
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01-12-2010, 05:50 PM	#2
Terrance28 Brigadier General 109 Rep 3,334 Posts Drives: Crimson Red E92 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Killeen, TX iTrader: (17)	I wouldn't run pure meth its very flammable. Besides I don't think you will yield any more gains running 100% vs 60/40 or so. I also get meth here at $4 a gallon. __________________ Mods list got too long, lets just say more than enough.
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01-12-2010, 06:31 PM	#3
scottp999 Brigadier General 133 Rep 4,764 Posts Drives: 4runner SR5 Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: MD iTrader: (2) Garage List 2007 BMW 335 [9.00]	Be careful M3 and M5 have additives for cars that run meth as the main fuel, not an injection kit like we are using. Stick with M1 which has no additives (So you don't destroy your injection pump early).
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01-12-2010, 06:38 PM	#4
Htown09 Captain 44 Rep 783 Posts Drives: E92 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Earth iTrader: (3)	I was told that you need lube that M1 does not have. And M3 and M5 already have it added.
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01-12-2010, 06:54 PM	#6
scottp999 Brigadier General 133 Rep 4,764 Posts Drives: 4runner SR5 Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: MD iTrader: (2) Garage List 2007 BMW 335 [9.00]	Take a look at this thread: http://forums.evolutionm.net/water-a...-methanol.html
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01-12-2010, 07:25 PM	#7
scottp999 Brigadier General 133 Rep 4,764 Posts Drives: 4runner SR5 Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: MD iTrader: (2) Garage List 2007 BMW 335 [9.00]	Found these statements over on srt-4 forums as well: Aquamist has found that the additive in VP M5 will cause premature seal failures in the Shurflo pumps as well as our flow sensors. Given that, M5 WILL make more power over M1 For warranty purposes and in regards to 100% methanol injection, Aquamist users are advised to try and use the purest methanol available and methanol that does not have additives. VP-M1 meets these requirements. --------------------------------------------- To be clear, using the methanol's available from VP as an example, everyone needs to understand that there's additives in all of them with the exception of M1. It's the additives that will attack the seals of the Surflo pumps, and over time the pumps will leak as a result. The situation of pump failures due to using methanol versus a mix is not unique to one kit maker. Also, when buying methanol buy the factory sealed (unopened) 5 gal pals of VP M1 or methanol equivalent to VP M1. VP M1 is about the purest methanol (no additives) that can be easily obtained by most people.
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01-12-2010, 08:18 PM	#8
qwks6 New Member 0 Rep 14 Posts Drives: '13 650i Gran Coupe Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Ca iTrader: (0)	us in the turbo buick community run pure meth with great success. We say why run 50/50 except for a pump and nozzle that aren't set up for pure meth. But tuning this engine is very new, the turbo buicks have a 20 year advantage in testing and experimenting. Water doesn't add power. It helps suppress knock, but not better than meth. What you run really depends on your setup.
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01-12-2010, 08:33 PM	#9
O-cha Brigadier General 218 Rep 4,726 Posts Drives: Mcoupe Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: In front of you iTrader: (2)	Scott, its the m5 only that causes trouble, m3 is only m1 with m2 lubrication added. The m2 lubrication does not damage seals, it protects seals. It also lubricates surfaces like valve guides which a direct injection engine that has no fuel flowing past the valves could most definitely benefit from. __________________
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01-12-2010, 08:55 PM	#10
Htown09 Captain 44 Rep 783 Posts Drives: E92 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Earth iTrader: (3)	So M3 is good to use? But in coolingmist and snow kit's since we are using injection system and pump's, is running pure meth and pump gas recommended?
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01-12-2010, 10:17 PM	#13
Htown09 Captain 44 Rep 783 Posts Drives: E92 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Earth iTrader: (3)	If Coolingmist is listening, will we notice a difference in power by running pure M3 and 93 octane pump gas versus a mixture of meth/water and 93 pump gas? In other words, would we be able to run a higher race map with the pure m3/93 than we would utilizing the m3/water/93 mixture?
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01-12-2010, 10:17 PM	#14
coolingmist Lieutenant 31 Rep 408 Posts Drives: 2009 135I 2006 Lotus Elise Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Atlanta, GA iTrader: (0)	its been our experience from our customers that M1 is the only one to use, no additives should be used. We have cases of M3 causing damage to seals, I am not familiar with the others. The pump does not need any lubrication. Any kind of hydro-carbon will kill the pump seals. CM
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01-12-2010, 10:19 PM	#15
Htown09 Captain 44 Rep 783 Posts Drives: E92 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Earth iTrader: (3)	Ok so M1 is the one to purchase. Have you any info on running pure M1 vs. M1/water mix. Any testing done using pure M1 or M1/water mixture..
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01-12-2010, 10:21 PM	#16
coolingmist Lieutenant 31 Rep 408 Posts Drives: 2009 135I 2006 Lotus Elise Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Atlanta, GA iTrader: (0)	I like running water with meth, however many like 100% meth. I hate to break the bad news, but for everyone that says pure meth is best, there are those that say 50/50 is better. I like some water because its better for preventing detonation IMHO. Again, thats my opinion. CM
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01-12-2010, 10:36 PM	#18
Htown09 Captain 44 Rep 783 Posts Drives: E92 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Earth iTrader: (3)	[QUOTE=335i82108;6514959]i beg to differ 100 meth is bettter[/QUOTE What is your reason? You can't just state something and leave it at that. Have you run higher race maps with pure meth and no detonation and made more power than 50/50?
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01-12-2010, 10:39 PM	#19
coolingmist Lieutenant 31 Rep 408 Posts Drives: 2009 135I 2006 Lotus Elise Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Atlanta, GA iTrader: (0)	I like 100% water as well. Like I said, asking this question is almost pointless. You will get a different response from everyone. CM
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01-12-2010, 10:42 PM	#20
BoostedCosta SUPERMAN 121 Rep 3,171 Posts Drives: AW e90 335i M-Sport Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: nj iTrader: (6)	well i dont know about our cars but someone tested 100% meth and meth mix and it turned out that 100 was actually better http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...-50-mix-42915/ __________________ MODS: JB3 18ohm \| AR Design Catlles Downpipes \| CDV Delete \| Clutch Masters FX400 \| ZEX Nitrous Kit \| Devils Own Methonal Kit \| VMR V701 (Matte Black) \| H&r Race Springs\| BMW Perf Grilles\|
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