[fisherbln]

Background: I bought a used 2007 335i coupe last week. The car has 41k miles and is still covered under the original factory warranty through September 2010. The sticker showed "Full factory warranty" on it. I bought from an out of state dealer, so my service is at a local dealer (different from where I purchased).

Story: I took the car in for service this weekend and inquired about suspension noise. I had also noticed that the front, drivers side sway bar link didn't look good. So I told the SA to have the tech start his investigation there. I just got a call from the SA and he says the car has aftermarket sway bars on it and the sway bar links are not the same size as stock so they can't replace it under warranty!

The aftermarket sway bars were not disclosed at sale and the sticker did say "Full factory warranty", not "everything except the aftermarket sway bars." I believe the dealer I bought the car from should have to warranty (pay for) the aftermarket sway bar link as a result. They say it was sold as used and thus there is no implied warranty. I beg to differ considering the actual sales documents refer to the implied and written warranties. Am I out of my mind or should I pursue this?

[e90prelci]

I dont think any dealer will warranty any aftermarket part for any reason. they will tell you to just remove the part or help you remove the part at most (from the dealership you got the car from). cant you just remove the sway bar?

[F32Fleet]

You're SOL. You bought used not CPO. I would think you may have an arguement if CPO because the car must be stock, but then of course then the issue will be when were the aftermarket parts added. I imagine a pre-purchase inspection was not done prior to buying the car??

[sleepyx637]

did you guys even take the time to fully read OP's post? he's not asking the BMW dealer to do the warranty work -- he's asking if the seller should have to pay.

OP, i think you should definitely talk to the dealer you bought it from and make your arguments about the warranty. tell them that a large part of the reason you bought the car was because they stated that there was a full factory warranty remaining and thus you thought you'd have 9,000 miles to work everything out with bmw before the warranty expired. therefore, they should cover any work that wouldve been done under warranty but which you're being denied for. your case is probably even stronger if it was a bmw dealership that you bought from because they (should have) inspected and and knew about the aftermarket sways. good luck.

[742]

"Full Factory Warranty" would not include after market parts that are on the car. It might be a different case if the car were advertised with a "bumper to bumper warranty" or some similar wording. But the factory warranty is what it is, and it does not cover modifications.

If you had bought the car locally I could see pushing the point with the dealer as simply a matter of good will. But you are dealing with three entities, none of which are going to see any point in going the extra mile. BMW gives you warranty coverage, but clearly exempts after market parts. The local dealer who is doing the work has no reason to eat the cost of the repair. And the dealer that you bought it from is out of state, so he probably does not expect to ever see you again even if he were to pay for the repair.

Just an Internet opinion.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by sleepyx637

did you guys even take the time to fully read OP's post? he's not asking the BMW dealer to do the warranty work -- he's asking if the seller should have to pay.

OP, i think you should definitely talk to the dealer you bought it from and make your arguments about the warranty. tell them that a large part of the reason you bought the car was because they stated that there was a full factory warranty remaining and thus you thought you'd have 9,000 miles to work everything out with bmw before the warranty expired. therefore, they should cover any work that wouldve been done under warranty but which you're being denied for. your case is probably even stronger if it was a bmw dealership that you bought from because they (should have) inspected and and knew about the aftermarket sways. good luck.

He bought it from a "out of state dealer". So yes, I'd say we read his post. When you buy used 99% of the time the sticker says "As is" and mentions whether nor not there's a factory warranty. There isn't one car dealership out there who will spend $$ to return a car to stock, or even bother to put the car on a lift if it's being sold used and not CPO. It matters not that he bought it from a BMW dealership.

[fisherbln]

Yes, I bought the car from a BMW dealership. The sticker did not say "as-is" anywhere and specifically stated that the entire car is fully covered. I was actually surprised at how specific it was.

I talked a little bit with the seller and while they were not immediately willing to cover it, it looks like they will be more than willing to ship me a replacement sway bar link if I can figure out which OEM part it is. Install will be left for me, but that's not really a problem.

It is not the stock sway bar link, but it does look OEM (on first glance) so I'll look for a part number or try to figure out which sway bar brand is on the car and go from there. Thanks for the replies!

[sleepyx637]

Originally Posted by Socom

He bought it from a "out of state dealer". So yes, I'd say we read his post. When you buy used 99% of the time the sticker says "As is" and mentions whether nor not there's a factory warranty. There isn't one car dealership out there who will spend $$ to return a car to stock, or even bother to put the car on a lift if it's being sold used and not CPO. It matters not that he bought it from a BMW dealership.

fisherbln's post mentions that there was a full factory warranty, so he already puts himself in your 1% of non-"as-is" sales. If the dealer didn't bother to inspect the car before putting up for sale and advertising "full factory warranty," then that's really the dealer's problem. Why should fisherbln have to pay for the dealer's mistake? I'd argue that saying there's full factory warranty remaining when there isn't is at least false advertising and perhaps fraud.

fisherbln, getting the end link paid for is a good start, but I'd try and get everything paid for, since that's what the factory warranty would cover.

[LetsRock]

The dealership is only obligated to cover the parts of the car NOT impacted by the non-factory components. If your AC dies, you are still covered for THAT component and such.

[fisherbln]

Originally Posted by LetsRock

The dealership is only obligated to cover the parts of the car NOT impacted by the non-factory components. If your AC dies, you are still covered for THAT component and such.

I agree with you 100% if I had put the part on or had it been disclosed prior to sale. However, since the vehicle was described as "FULL FACTORY WARRANTY" it is implied that the car is still fully covered as it was from the factory, not every part except for the ones that were replaced with non-factory parts and you don't know about. The sales agreement even references that there are several "Implied warranties" several times as well.

I'm not trying to be a jerk with them or anything, but I do believe that if you are going to label a car as "FULL FACTORY WARRANTY" then you should at least do an inspection of the car before you sell it and make sure that is the case. Also, if this weren't a BMW dealer, I would likely be a bit more lenient too.

The dealership seems to agree that they are (at least) partially liable as they've agreed to make it right by providing the part. I can do the install myself, that's not a big deal. That's all I needed and I appreciate them taking care of it.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by sleepyx637

fisherbln's post mentions that there was a full factory warranty, so he already puts himself in your 1% of non-"as-is" sales. If the dealer didn't bother to inspect the car before putting up for sale and advertising "full factory warranty," then that's really the dealer's problem. Why should fisherbln have to pay for the dealer's mistake? I'd argue that saying there's full factory warranty remaining when there isn't is at least false advertising and perhaps fraud.

fisherbln, getting the end link paid for is a good start, but I'd try and get everything paid for, since that's what the factory warranty would cover.

Like I also said per the OP the car was not CPO'd therefore the selling dealership is under NO obligation to inspect the car to insure it's in stock form. Whether there's a factory warranty or not is immaterial. Factory warranty does attest to the current condition of the vehicle. That's what CPO is for.

This really isn't all that hard.

[kgb1637]

Originally Posted by Socom

Like I also said per the OP the car was not CPO'd therefore the selling dealership is under NO obligation to inspect the car to insure it's in stock form. Whether there's a factory warranty or not is immaterial. Factory warranty does attest to the current condition of the vehicle. That's what CPO is for.

This really isn't all that hard.

This sucks, but again, its not a CPO, a non-BMW dealer is not going to do any inspection, all they'll do is call BMW and ask if the car has a warranty, once this is verified they can say this. You should have had an independent inspection done by a BMW dealer or someone who has experience in these things.

[sleepyx637]

Originally Posted by Socom

Like I also said per the OP the car was not CPO'd therefore the selling dealership is under NO obligation to inspect the car to insure it's in stock form. Whether there's a factory warranty or not is immaterial. Factory warranty does attest to the current condition of the vehicle. That's what CPO is for.

This really isn't all that hard.

Yes, part of the CPO is to inspect the car and also to extend the warranty. But do you really think a BMW dealership would buy a used car without inspecting it, even if they weren't going to CPO it? Granted, they may not have checked for a sway bar, but when a dealer advertises a full factory warranty remaining, this implies that they know that their advertisement is true. And if their advertisement turns out to be wrong, the burden should be on the dealer to correct the situation because they were the one in the best position to discover the issue. Now, if they had advertised the car "as-is," then OP would have been more wary, and he may have done a more detailed inspection or hired his own inspector, and may have discovered the aftermarket parts himself. And if OP didn't discover the aftermarket parts in an "as-is" sale, then OP should be the one footing the bill because he was the one in the best position to discover the issue.

By your logic, if the dealer knows the car has downpipes, cat delete, jb3, etc. and has been red-flagged for every part except the interior trim, the dealer can still advertise that the car has full factory warranty. That's false advertising, misrepresentation and perhaps fraud.

Obviously, the dealer feels that they are responsible, which is why they're picking up the tab for parts.

Originally Posted by kgb1637

This sucks, but again, its not a CPO, a non-BMW dealer is not going to do any inspection, all they'll do is call BMW and ask if the car has a warranty, once this is verified they can say this. You should have had an independent inspection done by a BMW dealer or someone who has experience in these things.

I believe OP mentioned he purchased the car from a BMW dealer, just one that was out-of-state.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by sleepyx637

Yes, part of the CPO is to inspect the car and also to extend the warranty. But do you really think a BMW dealership would buy a used car without inspecting it, even if they weren't going to CPO it? .

YES. This happens more often than you might think. Sometimes the cars go straight to auction.

[LetsRock]

Originally Posted by kgb1637

This sucks, but again, its not a CPO, a non-BMW dealer is not going to do any inspection, all they'll do is call BMW and ask if the car has a warranty, once this is verified they can say this. You should have had an independent inspection done by a BMW dealer or someone who has experience in these things.

This is the issue you will get if you buy ANY car from an independent dealer that carries multiple brands and specializes in NONE. There is no way they can be experts on all the components and features of each vehicle.

If it drives and has no mechanical issues, they will give you a 1000 mile/30 day dealer warranty and any other issues should be taken up with the manuafacturer.

When shopping for a used car, you MUST be fully informed of ALL the features and details of the car you are buying, because the salesman only cares about getting you to drive it off the lot.

[kgb1637]

I took it as the OP bought it from a non-BMW dealer, but heres the thing, if it was a BMW dealer, and its NOT CPO, a lot more questions have to be asked then does it have the original warranty.

[fisherbln]

Originally Posted by kgb1637

I took it as the OP bought it from a non-BMW dealer, but heres the thing, if it was a BMW dealer, and its NOT CPO, a lot more questions have to be asked then does it have the original warranty.

I bought the car from a BMW dealer that only sells BMWs, no other brands at this location. The issue was found less than 1000 miles (1.5 weeks) after purchase. You guys are welcome to keep debating whether they should cover it, but I've been taken care of, so I'm happy.

[David1]

Full factory warranty only covers originally installed equipment no aftermaket parts unless the parts are from BMW, but they have their own coverage. That is what it means, period, as stated in the owners manual and warranty book.

[sleepyx637]

Originally Posted by David1

Full factory warranty only covers originally installed equipment no aftermaket parts unless the parts are from BMW, but they have their own coverage. That is what it means, period, as stated in the owners manual and warranty book.

no one said full factory warranty should cover the problem -- OP's argument, which I support and which the seller obviously felt was correct, is that the seller should have to cover the problem because they advertised "full factory warrant" when in fact that was not true.

[cb1111]

Rather than spending 500 posts arguing over what "full factory warranty" means, let's look at the specific issue.

The OP bought a car that was sold in perfect mechanical condition with warranty at a BMW dealer.

The OP has a noise that was traced to a non-OE part.

The seller has an obligation to make it right - replacing the aftermarket part with the OE part and resolving the noise issue. You didn't tell us what state the car was purchased in but many states have strict laws governing the sale of used cars by dealers.

Me? I'd be worried about what else is non-OE.

[David1]

Originally Posted by cb1111

Rather than spending 500 posts arguing over what "full factory warranty" means, let's look at the specific issue.

The OP bought a car that was sold in perfect mechanical condition with warranty at a BMW dealer.

The OP has a noise that was traced to a non-OE part.

The seller has an obligation to make it right - replacing the aftermarket part with the OE part and resolving the noise issue. You didn't tell us what state the car was purchased in but many states have strict laws governing the sale of used cars by dealers.

Me? I'd be worried about what else is non-OE.

The seller or the manufacturer has no obligation in this case. The only reason the selling dealer got the parts was for reputation only and nothing else.

[sleepyx637]

Originally Posted by David1

The seller or the manufacturer has no obligation in this case.

agreed that the manufactuerer has no obligation. but for the seller, not sure what are you basing your statement on...what do you say in response to my hypo above: "By your logic, if the dealer knows the car has downpipes, cat delete, jb3, etc. and has been red-flagged for every part except the interior trim, the dealer can still advertise that the car has full factory warranty. That's false advertising, misrepresentation and perhaps fraud." ?

Originally Posted by David1

The only reason the selling dealer got the parts was for reputation only and nothing else.

one can just as easily argue that the seller no longer needs to worry about reputation, given that this was an out of state sale and OP will probably never buy from them again or ever go to them for service.