Info on E92 M3 production start and March release + M3 20th Anniversary year is now!

JK42 · 10-23-2006, 08:34 PM

Some E92/E90 M3 news.

Talked to the senior sales rep today while picking up the new facelifted X3 3.0sd (210kW/580Nm twin-turbodiesel - nice - SAV, not nice.) for a test drive and track (traffic today, track and photo-session tomorrow with a professional photographer.)

Geneva: Many BMW sales reps already have airline tickets and hotel reservations for it (the guy I was talking to, included.) E92 M3 will be released there unless the world ends is what he said. Also, production of the E92 M3 model at one of the biggest BMW plants in Bavaria is scheduled to begin in March. Lots of BMW's test E92 M3's are driving around germany without any cover tape at all any more. (That's where all the photos are coming from.) E92 will be the release & demo version, Sedan will follow later, as there is not much interest in M3 sedans in Europe. I guess all this means that demo and test drive cars will be available very soon, he told me to get ready to rip one apart (stress test) on a track here this coming spring 2007. Can't wait. BMW doesn't have it on their ordering system yet (naturally) and March is when their official channels will release the information about it and add it to the order system. Customer deliveries in Europe expected in Summer 2007. He was very definite about this, since the factory will start rolling the cars out in March. The time between the start of production and delivery is usually around 3-4 months. If the car is built on the same continent (European BMWs for Europe closer to 3 months, US BMW's X5 and Z4 for US, closer to 3 months).

When asked, he said that United States will probably get it later because they need to comply with emissions testing and other time consuming crap in the US, and very likely there will be minor modifications on the US version here and there, like for most M cars. At least one of these differences is, that there will be a vents in the rear silencers that open up at about 4500rpm to let out even more brutal engine sounds in the Euro version (just like on the Z4 M's) and that is not allowed in the US so the silencers and related parts will have to be re-engineered for the US versions. But at least the wait won't be as bad as with the M6, which was released at the exact same time in Europe as the M5, but only made it's way into the US way over a year later, much, much later than the M5.

There should also be some new BMW concepts unveiled, one of them may be related to the hydrogen power project, don't know which since the 760h has already been fully released and introduced. Anyway, BMW always keeps the number of car releases down per each show to focus attention on the cars that they do release. And since it's the 20th anniversary year of the first M3 (1986), there will be special events, podcasts, M3 history and other marketing propaganda widely available on the world wide web, car magazines and other media when the new M3 is officially released. It'll be the 4th generation M3 (E30, E36, E46 being the 3 priors.)

This is what I got from the sales rep today.

Best regards,

Jussi

swamp2 · 10-23-2006, 08:44 PM

Well, pehaps I will wait until an official announcement from BWM or the show itself. Probably will be there on business then anyway. You can count on me for a full report then....

replicat · 10-23-2006, 09:06 PM

Thanks Jussi,

-Pete

visor · 10-23-2006, 11:12 PM

Thanx for the info!

So, the E90 M3 (sedan) will be a few months after the E92 M3?

Just like the E90 335i vs. the E92 335i?

JK42 · 10-24-2006, 01:33 AM

Yes,

Except in this case the E92 M3 Coupé will be first, then the E90 M3 Sedan. The Sedan was released first on the basic models, if you remember? But yes, you're right that with the model 335i the Coupé was first, followed up by a engine lineup-change on the E90 family and the addition of 335i and 335dA models from the Coupés into the Sedan-family. (All E90's will get the updated Coupé E92 engines this fall, in cases where updates happened, such as the E90 330i that will get the bit more powerful 200kW/315Nm N52B30 from the E92 replacing it's old E90 N52B30 release version that was with 190kW/300Nm.)

Best regards,

Jussi

meruyailir · 10-24-2006, 02:43 AM

Where can I find the M3 photos without any cover tape? So far I've seen only covered ones.

Thanks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JK42

Some E92/E90 M3 news.

Talked to the senior sales rep today while picking up the new facelifted X3 3.0sd (210kW/580Nm twin-turbodiesel - nice - SAV, not nice.) for a test drive and track (traffic today, track and photo-session tomorrow with a professional photographer.)

Geneva: Many BMW sales reps already have airline tickets and hotel reservations for it (the guy I was talking to, included.) E92 M3 will be released there unless the world ends is what he said. Also, production of the E92 M3 model at one of the biggest BMW plants in Bavaria is scheduled to begin in March. Lots of BMW's test E92 M3's are driving around germany without any cover tape at all any more. (That's where all the photos are coming from.) E92 will be the release & demo version, Sedan will follow later, as there is not much interest in M3 sedans in Europe. I guess all this means that demo and test drive cars will be available very soon, he told me to get ready to rip one apart (stress test) on a track here this coming spring 2007. Can't wait. BMW doesn't have it on their ordering system yet (naturally) and March is when their official channels will release the information about it and add it to the order system. Customer deliveries in Europe expected in Summer 2007. He was very definite about this, since the factory will start rolling the cars out in March. The time between the start of production and delivery is usually around 3-4 months. If the car is built on the same continent (European BMWs for Europe closer to 3 months, US BMW's X5 and Z4 for US, closer to 3 months).

When asked, he said that United States will probably get it later because they need to comply with emissions testing and other time consuming crap in the US, and very likely there will be minor modifications on the US version here and there, like for most M cars. At least one of these differences is, that there will be a vents in the rear silencers that open up at about 4500rpm to let out even more brutal engine sounds in the Euro version (just like on the Z4 M's) and that is not allowed in the US so the silencers and related parts will have to be re-engineered for the US versions. But at least the wait won't be as bad as with the M6, which was released at the exact same time in Europe as the M5, but only made it's way into the US way over a year later, much, much later than the M5.

There should also be some new BMW concepts unveiled, one of them may be related to the hydrogen power project, don't know which since the 760h has already been fully released and introduced. Anyway, BMW always keeps the number of car releases down per each show to focus attention on the cars that they do release. And since it's the 20th anniversary year of the first M3 (1986), there will be special events, podcasts, M3 history and other marketing propaganda widely available on the world wide web, car magazines and other media when the new M3 is officially released. It'll be the 4th generation M3 (E30, E36, E46 being the 3 priors.)

This is what I got from the sales rep today.

Best regards,

Jussi

JK42 · 10-24-2006, 03:16 AM

http://www.germancarzone.com/ had a few from the US.

Best regards,

Jussi

Jason · 10-24-2006, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by meruyailir

Where can I find the M3 photos without any cover tape? So far I've seen only covered ones.

Thanks.

There are no 100% uncovered pics on the internet YET, but here are the most revealing pics so far --

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13067

meruyailir · 10-24-2006, 08:42 AM

Jussi, will the M3 have the head-up display as an option? Do you know?

JK42 · 10-24-2006, 08:57 AM

Meruyailir:

I don't know about the HUD. I have asked, people don't know. Since it is the 3-series, that would indicate that probably not. but since it'll have an SMG IV box and it's going to be "the premium M model" according to BMW, and it is the M3, that would lead me to believe that yes, it probably has the HUD. But this is just speculation.

Best regards,

Jussi

meruyailir · 10-24-2006, 09:37 AM

Premium M model? M itself is premium. What does it mean Premium M model?

JK42 · 10-24-2006, 10:15 AM

It means that in the family of M models, the M3 is the leading model, probably because it is the newest and will have the latest gadgets, including 9000rpm V8 and F1 type SMG IV gearbox that does upshifts without a clutch just by matching revs. It will also be the fastest.

Best regards,

Jussi

ogrady · 10-24-2006, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JK42

It means that in the family of M models, the M3 is the leading model, probably because it is the newest and will have the latest gadgets, including 9000rpm V8 and F1 type SMG IV gearbox that does upshifts without a clutch just by matching revs. It will also be the fastest.

Best regards,

Jussi

9k rpm redline !?!

OMG

Are you sure??

That's like the old S2000's redline

Frank_NJ · 10-24-2006, 10:30 AM

I never listen to what the salesmen say as they are as clueless to the release as the rest of the world. The best thing is to just wait unless you hear it from an actual BMW employee.

ogrady · 10-24-2006, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank_NJ

I never lsiten to what the salesmen say as they are as clueless to the release as the rest of the world. The best thing is to just wait.

Yep but always fun to speculate and see what comes true or else there'd be nothing at all to talk about right now

JK42 · 10-24-2006, 10:36 AM

This isn't from the salesmen. This is from the people who live in symbiosis with these cars. They have to know everything about them. Very little of my information is from salesmen, and what is, is usually something that they've heard when talking to BMW AG in München. It'll have a 9000rpm 4L V8.

I'm off to drive (for fun) now, returned the X3 few hours ago. Nice diesel, but I don't particulary like SAV/SUV type vehicles, their handling is terrible due to the high distribution of weight, and this was no exception. Better than the first X3, though, much better - and helluva better looking too!

Best regards,

Jussi

dcp-m3 · 10-24-2006, 01:24 PM

What will the max HP and torque be?

BevoRules · 10-24-2006, 01:45 PM

anyone know what the rules are for us Americans wanting the Euro version of the car? Can we use the european delivery method and get the Euro version or is there no way to circumvent the US standards?

JK42 · 10-24-2006, 05:40 PM

The maximum hp and torque are not known. The best information I have is around 450 for both. Those are the numbers I have heard the most consistently, and from most sources.

The european delivery will just deliver you a US spec car. You cannot circumvent the rules as I understand it, the vehicle needs to be EPA approved and all that for it to be registered in the US. Back in the '80s you used to be able to bring European versions of, for example, Ferraris into the states, pay the gas guzzler tax and be done with it, but not anymore, now it's almost as complex as getting a new drug approved with the FDA if a company wishes to sell a car model in the US market.

Best regards,

Jussi

Zshazz · 10-24-2006, 05:45 PM

Wait wait wait... 450 for both HP and Torque... AND a 9000 RPM redline? I hope you'll excuse me if I doubt you a bit. You have to admit, that is kind of unbelievable. Although, I'll recognize that you aren't guaranteeing anything like that, but rather that is what you've heard.

If it is true, though...

If it's true, then surely this car will be ridiculously fast.

dcp-m3 · 10-24-2006, 05:52 PM

450 torque and HP doesn't sound right. It would be more like 450hp and about 354 tourque as compared to the E46 M3, but I hope to god I'm wrong.

If all this info i am hearing is true then I hope to purchase one in the summer of 2008 after I pay off the one I have now... haha Plus by then prices will setlle in after all the hype.

JK42 · 10-24-2006, 05:58 PM

That is what I have heard the most often and the most consistently. BMW does the best engines in the world, and the M section does them even better. It's not like it wouldn't be doable, actually, I'd be surprised if they couldn't pull it off with todays technology. They surely could do much more back in 2001 with the M3 GTR's V8, granted that it was a pure race machine. But still. M engines are known to generate more than 100hp per liter N/A, that should be a given. And they are known for their great torque. The S85B50 V10 on the M5/M6 does 507hp and 520Nm with 4.999cm3 displacement. It was designed now almost over 4 years ago. To pull off another improvement that would bring around 450/450 out of 3.999cm3 in the year 2006 shouldn't be that hard at all. Many people have speculated that the V8 will just be the S85B50 with 2 cylinders cut off. This will not be the case. M GmbH does not design engines this way. They don't go the path of least resistance. They always do the best they can given the technology of the day. If the M5/M6 didn't exist on the market, I bet they could even get 500/500 out of the 4L N/A these days. 450/450 is about the same performance per liter than the S54B32 for the M3 CSL did (it was upped to 360hp, 365Nm, 3.2L displacement.) Again, that engine was designed in 99-2000 - that is, 7 years ago. These days the M Motorsport division offers a Z4 M Coupé competition version which has the S54B32 tuned to give out 400hp+, meant for endurance races. It's called the Z4 M Rennsport, look it up. It is very light, has a high capacity gas tank and as I said, takes out over 400hp from the straight six. Granted, a total competition car again, but the engine is designed to last since it is meant especially for endurance races where you cannot change your engine. It's meant to run 24 hours at 7000-8400rpm at full hp/torque.

In light of these numbers, +-450hp/+-450Nm sounds almost trivial to me from the people who can do all the above-mentioned things.

Best regards,

Jussi

P.S. DCP-M3, we're talking Newtonmeters as a unit of torque, not Lb-ft. It's 450 Nm, not 450 lb-ft.

10-23-2006, 08:34 PM	#1
JK42 First Lieutenant 19 Rep 374 Posts Drives: E70 BMW X5 4.8i Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northern Europe iTrader: (0)	Info on E92 M3 production start and March release + M3 20th Anniversary year is now! Some E92/E90 M3 news. Talked to the senior sales rep today while picking up the new facelifted X3 3.0sd (210kW/580Nm twin-turbodiesel - nice - SAV, not nice.) for a test drive and track (traffic today, track and photo-session tomorrow with a professional photographer.) Geneva: Many BMW sales reps already have airline tickets and hotel reservations for it (the guy I was talking to, included.) E92 M3 will be released there unless the world ends is what he said. Also, production of the E92 M3 model at one of the biggest BMW plants in Bavaria is scheduled to begin in March. Lots of BMW's test E92 M3's are driving around germany without any cover tape at all any more. (That's where all the photos are coming from.) E92 will be the release & demo version, Sedan will follow later, as there is not much interest in M3 sedans in Europe. I guess all this means that demo and test drive cars will be available very soon, he told me to get ready to rip one apart (stress test) on a track here this coming spring 2007. Can't wait. BMW doesn't have it on their ordering system yet (naturally) and March is when their official channels will release the information about it and add it to the order system. Customer deliveries in Europe expected in Summer 2007. He was very definite about this, since the factory will start rolling the cars out in March. The time between the start of production and delivery is usually around 3-4 months. If the car is built on the same continent (European BMWs for Europe closer to 3 months, US BMW's X5 and Z4 for US, closer to 3 months). When asked, he said that United States will probably get it later because they need to comply with emissions testing and other time consuming crap in the US, and very likely there will be minor modifications on the US version here and there, like for most M cars. At least one of these differences is, that there will be a vents in the rear silencers that open up at about 4500rpm to let out even more brutal engine sounds in the Euro version (just like on the Z4 M's) and that is not allowed in the US so the silencers and related parts will have to be re-engineered for the US versions. But at least the wait won't be as bad as with the M6, which was released at the exact same time in Europe as the M5, but only made it's way into the US way over a year later, much, much later than the M5. There should also be some new BMW concepts unveiled, one of them may be related to the hydrogen power project, don't know which since the 760h has already been fully released and introduced. Anyway, BMW always keeps the number of car releases down per each show to focus attention on the cars that they do release. And since it's the 20th anniversary year of the first M3 (1986), there will be special events, podcasts, M3 history and other marketing propaganda widely available on the world wide web, car magazines and other media when the new M3 is officially released. It'll be the 4th generation M3 (E30, E36, E46 being the 3 priors.) This is what I got from the sales rep today. Best regards, Jussi
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10-23-2006, 08:44 PM	#2
swamp2 Lieutenant General 609 Rep 10,407 Posts Drives: E92 M3 Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: San Diego, CA USA iTrader: (3)	Time to get my ticket to Geneva Well, pehaps I will wait until an official announcement from BWM or the show itself. Probably will be there on business then anyway. You can count on me for a full report then....
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10-23-2006, 09:06 PM	#3
replicat Lieutenant 23 Rep 515 Posts Drives: 40MPG Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Southern California iTrader: (0)	Thanks Jussi, -Pete
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10-23-2006, 11:12 PM	#4
visor BMW, can I have some LSD please? 88 Rep 1,591 Posts Drives: 2017 F30 340i xDrive Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Vancouver, Canada iTrader: (0)	Thanx for the info! So, the E90 M3 (sedan) will be a few months after the E92 M3? Just like the E90 335i vs. the E92 335i? __________________ 2006 330i \| TiAg \| Black \| Al \| 6MT \| Sports Package \| Logic 7 retired 2008 335i \| AW \| Black \| Al \| 6MT \| Sports Package \| Logic 7 retired 2013 328xi \| Red \| Gray \| Al \| 8AT \| Sports Line \| Premium \| Executive \| Heat Pkg retired 2017 340i xDrive \| Estoril \| Black \| Al \| 8AT \| M Package
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10-24-2006, 01:33 AM	#5
JK42 First Lieutenant 19 Rep 374 Posts Drives: E70 BMW X5 4.8i Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northern Europe iTrader: (0)	Yes, Except in this case the E92 M3 Coupé will be first, then the E90 M3 Sedan. The Sedan was released first on the basic models, if you remember? But yes, you're right that with the model 335i the Coupé was first, followed up by a engine lineup-change on the E90 family and the addition of 335i and 335dA models from the Coupés into the Sedan-family. (All E90's will get the updated Coupé E92 engines this fall, in cases where updates happened, such as the E90 330i that will get the bit more powerful 200kW/315Nm N52B30 from the E92 replacing it's old E90 N52B30 release version that was with 190kW/300Nm.) Best regards, Jussi
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10-24-2006, 03:16 AM	#7
JK42 First Lieutenant 19 Rep 374 Posts Drives: E70 BMW X5 4.8i Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northern Europe iTrader: (0)	http://www.germancarzone.com/ had a few from the US. Best regards, Jussi
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10-24-2006, 08:42 AM	#9
meruyailir Lieutenant 40 Rep 470 Posts Drives: E90 325, E70 X5 3.0 Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Indonesia iTrader: (0)	Jussi, will the M3 have the head-up display as an option? Do you know?
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10-24-2006, 08:57 AM	#10
JK42 First Lieutenant 19 Rep 374 Posts Drives: E70 BMW X5 4.8i Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northern Europe iTrader: (0)	Meruyailir: I don't know about the HUD. I have asked, people don't know. Since it is the 3-series, that would indicate that probably not. but since it'll have an SMG IV box and it's going to be "the premium M model" according to BMW, and it is the M3, that would lead me to believe that yes, it probably has the HUD. But this is just speculation. Best regards, Jussi
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10-24-2006, 09:37 AM	#11
meruyailir Lieutenant 40 Rep 470 Posts Drives: E90 325, E70 X5 3.0 Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Indonesia iTrader: (0)	Premium M model? M itself is premium. What does it mean Premium M model?
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10-24-2006, 10:15 AM	#12
JK42 First Lieutenant 19 Rep 374 Posts Drives: E70 BMW X5 4.8i Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northern Europe iTrader: (0)	It means that in the family of M models, the M3 is the leading model, probably because it is the newest and will have the latest gadgets, including 9000rpm V8 and F1 type SMG IV gearbox that does upshifts without a clutch just by matching revs. It will also be the fastest. Best regards, Jussi
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10-24-2006, 10:30 AM	#14
Frank_NJ ///M Specialist 560 Rep 1,499 Posts Drives: E30 M3, E52 Z8, G83 M4Cx Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: NJ Shore iTrader: (0)	I never listen to what the salesmen say as they are as clueless to the release as the rest of the world. The best thing is to just wait unless you hear it from an actual BMW employee. __________________ 2023 M340ix my Daily Driver G83 M4CV, F80 M3 CS, E30 M3, Z8, other various BMW's Ferrari F8
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10-24-2006, 10:36 AM	#16
JK42 First Lieutenant 19 Rep 374 Posts Drives: E70 BMW X5 4.8i Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northern Europe iTrader: (0)	This isn't from the salesmen. This is from the people who live in symbiosis with these cars. They have to know everything about them. Very little of my information is from salesmen, and what is, is usually something that they've heard when talking to BMW AG in München. It'll have a 9000rpm 4L V8. I'm off to drive (for fun) now, returned the X3 few hours ago. Nice diesel, but I don't particulary like SAV/SUV type vehicles, their handling is terrible due to the high distribution of weight, and this was no exception. Better than the first X3, though, much better - and helluva better looking too! Best regards, Jussi
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10-24-2006, 01:24 PM	#17
dcp-m3 New Member 0 Rep 6 Posts Drives: 2003.5 BMW M3 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Mass iTrader: (0)	What will the max HP and torque be?
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10-24-2006, 01:45 PM	#18
BevoRules Enlisted Member 16 Rep 44 Posts Drives: '08 M3 Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Texas, USA iTrader: (0)	anyone know what the rules are for us Americans wanting the Euro version of the car? Can we use the european delivery method and get the Euro version or is there no way to circumvent the US standards?
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10-24-2006, 05:40 PM	#19
JK42 First Lieutenant 19 Rep 374 Posts Drives: E70 BMW X5 4.8i Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northern Europe iTrader: (0)	The maximum hp and torque are not known. The best information I have is around 450 for both. Those are the numbers I have heard the most consistently, and from most sources. The european delivery will just deliver you a US spec car. You cannot circumvent the rules as I understand it, the vehicle needs to be EPA approved and all that for it to be registered in the US. Back in the '80s you used to be able to bring European versions of, for example, Ferraris into the states, pay the gas guzzler tax and be done with it, but not anymore, now it's almost as complex as getting a new drug approved with the FDA if a company wishes to sell a car model in the US market. Best regards, Jussi
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10-24-2006, 05:45 PM	#20
Zshazz Private First Class 4 Rep 105 Posts Drives: 330xi Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: North Carolina, USA iTrader: (0)	Wait wait wait... 450 for both HP and Torque... AND a 9000 RPM redline? I hope you'll excuse me if I doubt you a bit. You have to admit, that is kind of unbelievable. Although, I'll recognize that you aren't guaranteeing anything like that, but rather that is what you've heard. If it is true, though... If it's true, then surely this car will be ridiculously fast.
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10-24-2006, 05:52 PM	#21
dcp-m3 New Member 0 Rep 6 Posts Drives: 2003.5 BMW M3 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Mass iTrader: (0)	450 torque and HP doesn't sound right. It would be more like 450hp and about 354 tourque as compared to the E46 M3, but I hope to god I'm wrong. If all this info i am hearing is true then I hope to purchase one in the summer of 2008 after I pay off the one I have now... haha Plus by then prices will setlle in after all the hype.
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10-24-2006, 05:58 PM	#22
JK42 First Lieutenant 19 Rep 374 Posts Drives: E70 BMW X5 4.8i Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northern Europe iTrader: (0)	That is what I have heard the most often and the most consistently. BMW does the best engines in the world, and the M section does them even better. It's not like it wouldn't be doable, actually, I'd be surprised if they couldn't pull it off with todays technology. They surely could do much more back in 2001 with the M3 GTR's V8, granted that it was a pure race machine. But still. M engines are known to generate more than 100hp per liter N/A, that should be a given. And they are known for their great torque. The S85B50 V10 on the M5/M6 does 507hp and 520Nm with 4.999cm3 displacement. It was designed now almost over 4 years ago. To pull off another improvement that would bring around 450/450 out of 3.999cm3 in the year 2006 shouldn't be that hard at all. Many people have speculated that the V8 will just be the S85B50 with 2 cylinders cut off. This will not be the case. M GmbH does not design engines this way. They don't go the path of least resistance. They always do the best they can given the technology of the day. If the M5/M6 didn't exist on the market, I bet they could even get 500/500 out of the 4L N/A these days. 450/450 is about the same performance per liter than the S54B32 for the M3 CSL did (it was upped to 360hp, 365Nm, 3.2L displacement.) Again, that engine was designed in 99-2000 - that is, 7 years ago. These days the M Motorsport division offers a Z4 M Coupé competition version which has the S54B32 tuned to give out 400hp+, meant for endurance races. It's called the Z4 M Rennsport, look it up. It is very light, has a high capacity gas tank and as I said, takes out over 400hp from the straight six. Granted, a total competition car again, but the engine is designed to last since it is meant especially for endurance races where you cannot change your engine. It's meant to run 24 hours at 7000-8400rpm at full hp/torque. In light of these numbers, +-450hp/+-450Nm sounds almost trivial to me from the people who can do all the above-mentioned things. Best regards, Jussi P.S. DCP-M3, we're talking Newtonmeters as a unit of torque, not Lb-ft. It's 450 Nm, not 450 lb-ft.
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