[e90bmw328i]

I APOLOGIZE FOR THE LONG POST.

Guys,
I need help understanding this $2150 service quote from my local service center here in Austin.

My car is a 2009 328i (39500 miles so far) which I bought last August as a CPO and the warranty expired this April. I went to a fairly trusted service center here to get the Regular Brake flush service (which BMW recommends every 2 years and also warned by the car) and the service guy slapped me with a $2150 quote. Why? below is the breakup:

1. Fan belt tensioner is weak and apparently there is a magnesium bolt that holds the belt tensioner in place. He showed me that the belt is already towards the edge of this tensioner. So he quoted me $505 for this service. Luckily for me BMW CPO covers this tensioner (not the belt itself) at a $50 deductibe. Thank God!!

2. Brake system - $1160 -> My car's computer says the brake pads are good for another 6000 miles on the front and 10000 on the rear. This guy showed me the pad sensors and they are almost about to touch the brake router. So he was suggesting I replace both the front and back pads. Also, he was suggesting replacing the routers which I am not sure is required.

3. Brake flush service - $116.50 -> Very reasonable compared to dealership price

4.Cooling system flushed - $128 -> He was saying that due to texas heat, its better to get the cooling system flushed every 3 years or so and since my car is already 4.5yrs old, its better to do it. SERIOUSLY???? On a car with 39K miles?

5.Oil change, filter, etc - $308 -> Again he kept saying that texas heat is brutal and I should change the oil every 5K miles. the oil change itself will cost $94 while the engine air filter, cabin filter, etc combined, its $308

Is he stealing money or just being honest here. Please help.

[GStar1]

Coolant exchange was recommended on time conditions, the coolant isn't necessarily bad, but over time it can develop to worse problems. Brake flush is essential as well, brakes are iffy..... even when the sensor DO touch the pad, you still have plenty of time left on the brake pads, and of course the back brakes wear slower than the front. As far as the service, the oil change isn't out of line as far as price, but I am sure you could install your own air filter and a/c microfilter... to save money

Where are you taking the car for service in Austin? I used to work at the dealer on McNeil, as far as my opinion goes, they are a very reputable shop with comparable prices to some of the indy's in Austin....

[e90bmw328i]

Originally Posted by GStar1

Coolant exchange was recommended on time conditions, the coolant isn't necessarily bad, but over time it can develop to worse problems. Brake flush is essential as well, brakes are iffy..... even when the sensor DO touch the pad, you still have plenty of time left on the brake pads, and of course the back brakes wear slower than the front. As far as the service, the oil change isn't out of line as far as price, but I am sure you could install your own air filter and a/c microfilter... to save money

Where are you taking the car for service in Austin? I used to work at the dealer on McNeil, as far as my opinion goes, they are a very reputable shop with comparable prices to some of the indy's in Austin....

I am going to this place called "luxury auto works" on Lamar. They have fairly good reviews on google and yelp.

I agree about brake flush being essential but I am not sure why I need to replace the rotors. They still look fine given the car barely has 39K miles. I am certainly going to change the air filters myself now and may be also do the brake pads myself. Seems fairly easy to do atleast from the online videos.

[El Cheapo Loco]

Brake pads - no need to replace until the sensors trip, 'almost' means not touching yet.
Brake rotors - check the lip. If there is a pronounced lip it's time to replace them. But 40k seems WAY too early especially the rear.
Brake flush - 40k seems early as well. I did mine at 80k. But I'm in CA where it's not as humid as TX. I'd say do it since it's cheap. Same for coolant.
Oil change - no reason to change every 5k. 8-10k is perfectly fine.

His prices are pretty inline with other indies. Price for brakes seems to point to OE parts. You can save a bit going with Zimmerman or Meyle. Save another $200 DIYing the air and cabin filters.

[Ph0zenstone]

Originally Posted by elcheapoloco

Brake pads - no need to replace until the sensors trip, 'almost' means not touching yet.
Brake rotors - check the lip. If there is a pronounced lip it's time to replace them. But 40k seems WAY too early especially the rear.
Brake flush - 40k seems early as well. I did mine at 80k. But I'm in CA where it's not as humid as TX. I'd say do it since it's cheap. Same for coolant.
Oil change - no reason to change every 5k. 8-10k is perfectly fine.

His prices are pretty inline with other indies. Price for brakes seems to point to OE parts. You can save a bit going with Zimmerman or Meyle. Save another $200 DIYing the air and cabin filters.

Brake fluid should be every two years.

[Saintor]

3. Brake flush service - $116.50 -> Very reasonable compared to dealership price

I paid the same at a BMW dealer.

Take your car elsewhere. 1160$ for the brake is excessivel

[Efthreeoh]

Seriously, please just tell this shop to fuck off. They are totally trying to rip you off. A few comments:

Brake system - Okay so the brake flush is probably not a bad price, but make sure your car is due for it. The due date is the build month every two years after the original build date of the car. You can check the build date on the drivers door jamb manufacturer's decal. If the build date is November 2009, then your 1st brake flush would have been November 2011 and the 2nd due November 2013.

Now regarding the brake pad replacement. He is stealing your money (and the price he quoted is atrocious anyway). The car has a brake pad wear sensing system that tells you when to replace the pads. Read the owner's manual and it will explain that a "brake" indicator symbol will illuminate and stay illuminated once the system determines a set of pads (front or rear, or both) is at minimum spec and needs replacement. The wear sensor is supposed to contact the rotor when the brakes are applied, that's how it gets worn down to determine when the pads are at minimum thickness. When the brakes are not applied the sensor does not forcefully contact the rotor (it is at the same level as the pad surface).

In any BMW since the mid-80's, all models have a brake wear monitoring system, and you do not need to replace the pads until the system indicates they need replacement; it is no more simpler than that. BMW brakes go a long time, unless you drive totally in the city with an automatic trans (as the same for most cars), but if your driving is mixed expect at least 50,000 miles out of the brakes.

Coolant - The coolant is good for 100,000 miles. You can replace it at any interval you want, but BMW's service interval for coolant is 100,000 miles. Texas heat has nothing to do with the condition of the coolant - LOL

Oil change - Most BMW dealers are now offering oil changes for $80. Changing the oil at 5,000 miles intervals is a complete waste of money, even in Texas heat!

Air filters - The engine air filter is replaced every 3rd oil service (BMW's schedule of approx. 15,000 miles, so at around 45,000 miles). If you drive in a dusty location, then you should change it more frequently than 45,000 miles. The cabin air filter is determined by the CBS on the early model cars, I'm not sure if the 2009's still has the interval built into the CBS system. The owner's manual should tell you the interval. The cabin air filter is the easiest DIY to do - just suggesting. It's a $15 part.

Belt-tensioner - The belt should be at the edge of the pulley, there is really no room for it to be any place else. If the belt is slipping and making noise, then you could have an issue. If the pulley bearing is going bad it will start to chirp and make noise. The only need to replace the belt is when it starts cracking on the inside ribs. The belt does not have a replacement interval, other than observation of rib cracks. The belt is about $20. There have been instances of the tensioner mounting bolt breaking on some models, but the N52 in your car generally doesn't have the issue. If the bolt breaks then you'll know it. Is the belt making any noise? If it is not, then I doubt you have an issue. Have him attach the tool to move the tensioner (against its spring tension) and see how hard it is to move, it should take a lot of effort to move the tensioner. If the spring in it is broken then it will be easy to move, but the belt would have fallen off by now, or squealing quite loudly. My 2006 325i is still running the original belt tensioner at 232,000 miles.

My two cents...

[e90bmw328i]

Thanks for all the replies. I think I will wait for the car's brake indicator to trip. My car was due for a brake fluid flush this March which I just reset the warning light (but made sure the brake fluid was clear and upto the max marker). Going over a lot of the DIY guides (including pelican parts DIY), brake pad and rotor replacement is rated as Job difficulty level 2 (1 being filling air in the tires). I will do the brake flush after I finish the brake pad installation as there is no point doing it now. I have read many people do their brake flush every 3 years.

Same with the air filter. I have done it on all my previous cars. Will save that money towards my daughter's college funds instead .

As for the belt tensioner, I have an appointment with BMW to check on it. I will also check with them on the status of my brakes just in case.

Akebono ceramic brakes seems to be one of the good ones with very little brake dust. Anyone have experience with these? Lifetime and braking ability?

[PichaDis11]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Seriously, please just tell this shop to fuck off. They are totally trying to rip you off. A few comments:

Brake system - Okay so the brake flush is probably not a bad price, but make sure your car is due for it. The due date is the build month every two years after the original build date of the car. You can check the build date on the drivers door jamb manufacturer's decal. If the build date is November 2009, then your 1st brake flush would have been November 2011 and the 2nd due November 2013.

Now regarding the brake pad replacement. He is stealing your money (and the price he quoted is atrocious anyway). The car has a brake pad wear sensing system that tells you when to replace the pads. Read the owner's manual and it will explain that a "brake" indicator symbol will illuminate and stay illuminated once the system determines a set of pads (front or rear, or both) is at minimum spec and needs replacement. The wear sensor is supposed to contact the rotor when the brakes are applied, that's how it gets worn down to determine when the pads are at minimum thickness. When the brakes are not applied the sensor does not forcefully contact the rotor (it is at the same level as the pad surface).

In any BMW since the mid-80's, all models have a brake wear monitoring system, and you do not need to replace the pads until the system indicates they need replacement; it is no more simpler than that. BMW brakes go a long time, unless you drive totally in the city with an automatic trans (as the same for most cars), but if your driving is mixed expect at least 50,000 miles out of the brakes.

Coolant - The coolant is good for 100,000 miles. You can replace it at any interval you want, but BMW's service interval for coolant is 100,000 miles. Texas heat has nothing to do with the condition of the coolant - LOL

Oil change - Most BMW dealers are now offering oil changes for $80. Changing the oil at 5,000 miles intervals is a complete waste of money, even in Texas heat!

Air filters - The engine air filter is replaced every 3rd oil service (BMW's schedule of approx. 15,000 miles, so at around 45,000 miles). If you drive in a dusty location, then you should change it more frequently than 45,000 miles. The cabin air filter is determined by the CBS on the early model cars, I'm not sure if the 2009's still has the interval built into the CBS system. The owner's manual should tell you the interval. The cabin air filter is the easiest DIY to do - just suggesting. It's a $15 part.

Belt-tensioner - The belt should be at the edge of the pulley, there is really no room for it to be any place else. If the belt is slipping and making noise, then you could have an issue. If the pulley bearing is going bad it will start to chirp and make noise. The only need to replace the belt is when it starts cracking on the inside ribs. The belt does not have a replacement interval, other than observation of rib cracks. The belt is about $20. There have been instances of the tensioner mounting bolt breaking on some models, but the N52 in your car generally doesn't have the issue. If the bolt breaks then you'll know it. Is the belt making any noise? If it is not, then I doubt you have an issue. Have him attach the tool to move the tensioner (against its spring tension) and see how hard it is to move, it should take a lot of effort to move the tensioner. If the spring in it is broken then it will be easy to move, but the belt would have fallen off by now, or squealing quite loudly. My 2006 325i is still running the original belt tensioner at 232,000 miles.

My two cents...

This agreeable with an extra cent to please do what he says in bold.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by Metblack328i

Thanks for all the replies. I think I will wait for the car's brake indicator to trip. My car was due for a brake fluid flush this March which I just reset the warning light (but made sure the brake fluid was clear and upto the max marker). Going over a lot of the DIY guides (including pelican parts DIY), brake pad and rotor replacement is rated as Job difficulty level 2 (1 being filling air in the tires). I will do the brake flush after I finish the brake pad installation as there is no point doing it now. I have read many people do their brake flush every 3 years.

Same with the air filter. I have done it on all my previous cars. Will save that money towards my daughter's college funds instead .

As for the belt tensioner, I have an appointment with BMW to check on it. I will also check with them on the status of my brakes just in case.

Akebono ceramic brakes seems to be one of the good ones with very little brake dust. Anyone have experience with these? Lifetime and braking ability?

My advice for brakes are to always replace pads and rotors as a set and use BMW OEM parts. If you DIY the brakes then even more so follow this suggestion. The rotors need to be resurfaced when new pads are used, being the rotors are only about another $120 in parts, vs. $50 to resurface, it's better to get new rotors. My experience with BMW rotors are they never last all the way through the second set of pads.

Most on-line OEM part sellers offer pads and rotor sets for about $325 per axle.

[GStar1]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Seriously, please just tell this shop to fuck off. They are totally trying to rip you off. A few comments:

Brake system - Okay so the brake flush is probably not a bad price, but make sure your car is due for it. The due date is the build month every two years after the original build date of the car. You can check the build date on the drivers door jamb manufacturer's decal. If the build date is November 2009, then your 1st brake flush would have been November 2011 and the 2nd due November 2013.

Now regarding the brake pad replacement. He is stealing your money (and the price he quoted is atrocious anyway). The car has a brake pad wear sensing system that tells you when to replace the pads. Read the owner's manual and it will explain that a "brake" indicator symbol will illuminate and stay illuminated once the system determines a set of pads (front or rear, or both) is at minimum spec and needs replacement. The wear sensor is supposed to contact the rotor when the brakes are applied, that's how it gets worn down to determine when the pads are at minimum thickness. When the brakes are not applied the sensor does not forcefully contact the rotor (it is at the same level as the pad surface).

In any BMW since the mid-80's, all models have a brake wear monitoring system, and you do not need to replace the pads until the system indicates they need replacement; it is no more simpler than that. BMW brakes go a long time, unless you drive totally in the city with an automatic trans (as the same for most cars), but if your driving is mixed expect at least 50,000 miles out of the brakes.

Coolant - The coolant is good for 100,000 miles. You can replace it at any interval you want, but BMW's service interval for coolant is 100,000 miles. Texas heat has nothing to do with the condition of the coolant - LOL

Oil change - Most BMW dealers are now offering oil changes for $80. Changing the oil at 5,000 miles intervals is a complete waste of money, even in Texas heat!

Air filters - The engine air filter is replaced every 3rd oil service (BMW's schedule of approx. 15,000 miles, so at around 45,000 miles). If you drive in a dusty location, then you should change it more frequently than 45,000 miles. The cabin air filter is determined by the CBS on the early model cars, I'm not sure if the 2009's still has the interval built into the CBS system. The owner's manual should tell you the interval. The cabin air filter is the easiest DIY to do - just suggesting. It's a $15 part.

Belt-tensioner - The belt should be at the edge of the pulley, there is really no room for it to be any place else. If the belt is slipping and making noise, then you could have an issue. If the pulley bearing is going bad it will start to chirp and make noise. The only need to replace the belt is when it starts cracking on the inside ribs. The belt does not have a replacement interval, other than observation of rib cracks. The belt is about $20. There have been instances of the tensioner mounting bolt breaking on some models, but the N52 in your car generally doesn't have the issue. If the bolt breaks then you'll know it. Is the belt making any noise? If it is not, then I doubt you have an issue. Have him attach the tool to move the tensioner (against its spring tension) and see how hard it is to move, it should take a lot of effort to move the tensioner. If the spring in it is broken then it will be easy to move, but the belt would have fallen off by now, or squealing quite loudly. My 2006 325i is still running the original belt tensioner at 232,000 miles.

My two cents...

you are completely right, except, coolant will turn acidic over time caused by heat, its called degradation....

[Three_thirty_I]

Pretty clear these guys are trying to take a fat chance here and rip you off!

Having the fluids replaced every two years is correct and ensures longevity for these cars, and with my rough calculation the prices seem fair.

The tensioner being weak is strange for the age and mileage, but it this is the case then fine - can be DIY'd and yes, the aluminium bolt has to be replaced along with the tensioner.

Brakes sound like they still have plenty of life in them still! My 330i still has the original front rotors, albeit the car only has 72k km on the clock - the rears were replaced beginning of last year after the BMW dealer over-adjusted the handbrake causing it to bind and over-heat! Had them replace at their cost the disks and handbrake shoes. They did however replace all brake pads even though they had not tripped the wear indicators - most likely also close to the wear sensor touching the disks, but with the motorplan ending I gather they decided to do this which was great. Oh, I did complain about the brakes squealing at times, so that also helped!

I would suggest DIY for these sort of things - will save a packet doing it yourself, and really is not difficult if you have the tools etc. Scheduled services is the only time I will take my car to a proper workshop so that I can retain the car's full service history, but things that are more wear and tear and not really servicing as in fluid changes I would do myself.

Maybe post a few pics of your car's rotors to show their wear - best way to check is to use a vernier micrometer to measure the thickness of the wear area and compare against the minimum thickness. I think in general the pads do wear quicker than the rotors, so replacing the pads once, maybe even twice is possible on a set of rotors (twice is maybe pushing it though). Wear sensor can be reused if they have not tripped, but they are not so expensive to replace.

Hope this helps!

[Bmr3sn]

[

1. Fan belt tensioner is weak and apparently there is a magnesium bolt that holds the belt tensioner in place.

Plenty of DIY tutorials on how to do this. Even if its bad, less than $100 in parts and takes about 10 minutes including finding tools and opening packages. $500+ is waaaaay out of line.

2. Brake system - $1160 -> My car's computer says the brake pads are good for another 6000 miles on the front and 10000 on the rear. This guy showed me the pad sensors and they are almost about to touch the brake router. So he was suggesting I replace both the front and back pads. Also, he was suggesting replacing the routers which I am not sure is required.

Lots of DIY (videos as well). OEM is around $700..... aftermarket middle price range around $375 for everything you need..... rotors, pads, sensors, rotor screw bla bla bla

3. Brake flush service - $116.50 -> Very reasonable compared to dealership price

Not a great price, but not bad

4.Cooling system flushed - $128 -> He was saying that due to texas heat, its better to get the cooling system flushed every 3 years or so and since my car is already 4.5yrs old, its better to do it. SERIOUSLY???? On a car with 39K miles?

Not a great price, but not bad

5.Oil change, filter, etc - $308 -> Again he kept saying that texas heat is brutal and I should change the oil every 5K miles. the oil change itself will cost $94 while the engine air filter, cabin filter, etc combined, its $308

Oil change prices vary from $75 to $125 ish......
DIY the air and cabin filter, very easy, not worth paying someone to do it.

Is he stealing money or just being honest here. Please help.[/QUOTE]

Here is the big question. Do you have the ability, or want to do your own maintenance? if you don't............. the prices listed above are going to be pretty routine when you take it in. $500 here, $1200 now and then. Its a maintenance intensive car.

[e90bmw328i]

Ok. Finally got my car back from the dealership and here is the summary:

1. Belt tensioner: They replaced the entire belt tensioner unit (probably not the belt itself) at a $50 deductible since its covered under warranty. All good here.

2. Got the oil change done too at the dealership ($99). I will change the air filters myself.

3. Brakes had 6.5mm on the front and 5mm on the rear left. So the dealer said I dont need to do it yet.

What started as a $2150 quote finally ended with just $152 including tax :-). Eventually when the brake sensor kicks in, I will replace the rotor and pads myself.

[Three_thirty_I]

Originally Posted by Metblack328i

Ok. Finally got my car back from the dealership and here is the summary:

1. Belt tensioner: They replaced the entire belt tensioner unit (probably not the belt itself) at a $50 deductible since its covered under warranty. All good here.

2. Got the oil change done too at the dealership ($99). I will change the air filters myself.

3. Brakes had 6.5mm on the front and 5mm on the rear left. So the dealer said I dont need to do it yet.

What started as a $2150 quote finally ended with just $152 including tax :-). Eventually when the brake sensor kicks in, I will replace the rotor and pads myself.

There you go!! Glad you were able to avoid the daylight robbery!!