Second Gear Grind

[Derek8819]

Anyone else have this often?

Ive noticed it once before, but last night and this morning I had it. The car was fully warmed up, winding out first with some wheel spin, quick but deliberate shift, not power shifting or anything, and grrrrtrrrr. The shifter still went into gear fine both times, but obviously didn't like doing it for some reason. I have a BMS clutch stop with 2 washers installed, but haven't noticed any kind of lack of clutch disengagement.

I know BMW put the wrong tans fluid in it for the 1200 mile service, but it was caught by the previous owner before leaving the lot and was promptly changed.

What do you guys think?

[Dan Parker]

I've never had it but recall a few people talking about it. I think there's a thread lurking around here from 9-10 months ago.
As far as the wrong Trans fluid I wouldn't be concerned. They put the wrong fluid in mine and then I put 3 hours of very hot track time on my car + a few thousand miles. I sent a sample of the fluid to BlackStone Labs and the test came back without any issues. I figured I better cover my arse in case I had Trans issues later on.
I'd call your service advisor if there's any more grinding so they know it's happening. Another fluid change might be in order.

[1SerieStud]

0 grinding issues here. Take it in and have it looked at, at the very least for peace of mind.

[chachacha28]

i had the issue until i did the cdv delete.

[Derek8819]

Hmm, I will for sure have it looked at then. I have a CDV mod and BMS clutch stop.

[FactorX81]

I have this issue as well I have a regular 135i. Not sure if the trannys are similar but going into 2nd its rough its not a grind like if you let off of the clutch before its in but just rough. You can feel it in the shifter. I think the syncro's are just slow on that gear I would like to know if anyone got theirs looked at or fixed by the dealer for this.

[Dan Parker]

Since you did the CDV I'd Re-Bleed the clutch. We found it took much more bleeding then expected.

[Dackelone]

My shifter has always balked a little bit from day one. I have the CDV delete and that helps some what. At 32k miles I changed the trans fluid on my 135i with the BMW stuff (LT3 was spec'd for 135's) but bmw says now that LT4 is spec'd so that is what I used. It actually got worse I think. Then a few weeks ago I changed the trans fluid to Redline's ATF-D4. It is soooo butterly smooth now. No more balking when shifting from 1st to 2nd!! I should have just used Redline to begine with. I know your car is still under warranty... but I am really sold on Redline's gear oils.

I've been meaning to post pics of what the old trans gear oil looked like after just 12k miles! The old oil was all black, new it was golden brown. I plan on changing my Redline oil at my next oil change just to see what it looks like.

I highly reccomend Redline's ATF-D4 in our trans. Check with Redline to be sure though.

[flzrider]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

My shifter has always balked a little bit from day one. I have the CDV delete and that helps some what. At 32k miles I changed the trans fluid on my 135i with the BMW stuff (LT3 was spec'd for 135's) but bmw says now that LT4 is spec'd so that is what I used. It actually got worse I think. Then a few weeks ago I changed the trans fluid to Redline's ATF-D4. It is soooo butterly smooth now. No more balking when shifting from 1st to 2nd!! I should have just used Redline to begine with. I know your car is still under warranty... but I am really sold on Redline's gear oils.

I've been meaning to post pics of what the old trans gear oil looked like after just 12k miles! The old oil was all black, new it was golden brown. I plan on changing my Redline oil at my next oil change just to see what it looks like.

I highly reccomend Redline's ATF-D4 in our trans. Check with Redline to be sure though.

Hmmm, I wonder if that transmission fluid would work in place of the 1M's (and N55 powered 135i's) MTF LT-5 fluid.

[RimasRS]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

My shifter has always balked a little bit from day one. I have the CDV delete and that helps some what. At 32k miles I changed the trans fluid on my 135i with the BMW stuff (LT3 was spec'd for 135's) but bmw says now that LT4 is spec'd so that is what I used. It actually got worse I think. Then a few weeks ago I changed the trans fluid to Redline's ATF-D4. It is soooo butterly smooth now. No more balking when shifting from 1st to 2nd!! I should have just used Redline to begine with. I know your car is still under warranty... but I am really sold on Redline's gear oils.

I've been meaning to post pics of what the old trans gear oil looked like after just 12k miles! The old oil was all black, new it was golden brown. I plan on changing my Redline oil at my next oil change just to see what it looks like.

I highly reccomend Redline's ATF-D4 in our trans. Check with Redline to be sure though.

Interesting info Dave thanks for sharing
Just googled for it it says that this oil is for AT trans?

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by RimasRS

Interesting info Dave thanks for sharing
Just googled for it it says that this oil is for AT trans?

Yes, Redline's ATF-D4 (and D6, a thinner ATF oil) can be used for BOTH manual trans AND automatic trans. The reason why it can be used in a modern days manual trans is that the bearing tolerences are so tight that an ATF oil can still be used without breaking down and causing wear.

But as always check with redline and see what they reccomend!

[Dackelone]

So... last year I changed my manual trans fluid with what my BMW zentrum told me was the proper fluid. I have a 2010 US spec 6MT 135i. The car came with BMW fluid MTF-LT-3. My dealer said that LT-3 is now superceeded to LT-4. So I got 2.5L of LT-4 and changed my fluid last year. I did not really notice much a change in shifter effort.

The first time I changed the tranny fluid was at 52K kms. What came out was dark black fluid. I was glad I changed it. I also changed teh rear diff fluid with Castrol's SAF-XJ 75w140.

A little background... my shifter was always balky shifting from 1st to 2nd gear. Especially when the trans was cold. It would almost feel like it wanted to grind. But I never did make any noises - just that the gear lever was hard to move into 2nd gear. Later on when I had a performance SSK instaled the problem was the same. It just always balked when cold or on fast shifts when the trans was hot.

A few weeks ago I finally got around to changing my trans fluid again. This time I used a trans fluid I was familar with(I used Redline's ATF-D4 in my manual trans e36 years ago with great results). I used Redline's ATF-D4 trans fluid for my 135i manual trans. Redline says it can be used in BMW's even though it is a ATF fluid, for a manual trans use. Do you own research... but I am hapy with my choice.

From the moment I drove ten feet - I knew I made the right choice! The shifter effort is lighter and all that notchyness is gone. No more balking or problems when shifting from 1st to 2nd!! It really feels like a different transmision. Smooth as silk. I would highly reccomend using Redline's AFT-D4 to anyone sitting on the fence. I really can not believe I waited so long to try it. Partly it was warranty worries. But in the end you really have to pay to play. And I was at the point where this balky shifter was really starting to bother me.

Take a look at my pics. I think they say a lot about BMW's "lifetime fluids" nonsense!! Just look at the bottle on the left!! That is LT-4 with only 26K kms!!!! I wonder how bad it would look after 100K kms or 200K kms!!!


BMW MTF-LT-4 trans fluid. Left old used for 26K kms!
Right one, new LT-4 fluid.


old MTF-LT-4 used for 26K kms(!), new LT-4, new R.L. ATF-D4

[ayao]

This might be comparing apples to oranges but I had an increasingly balky 4th gear on my WRX... thought maybe a synchro was starting to go. Before throwing a ton of $ at it, replaced the stock gear oil with Redline and all the issues are resolved.

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by ayao

This might be comparing apples to oranges but I had an increasingly balky 4th gear on my WRX... thought maybe a synchro was starting to go. Before throwing a ton of $ at it, replaced the stock gear oil with Redline and all the issues are resolved.

Yes, I have had customer cars where we were gonna rebuilt the trans. We put in some BG's SynchroShift in and it really seem to fix the grinding issue. That stuff was kind of pricey though. $25/L (I think). Swepco is also another good transaxle oil (but for use in Porsche's).

I have always liked RedLine oils though. I don't use their engine oils, but I really like their gear oils like ATF-D4 or MTL for the diff.


Dack

[Venom]

I have an 08 135i which I initially had trouble 1->2 shifting. Eventually, I got used to the shift by taking that specific shift a bit slow. it was really irritating and embarrassing at first because the people who drove me around asked if I lost my talent for driving manuals. be patient with that one. it is finicky for me too and it took me 3 months to get used to what it needed to not be a jerky shift.

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by NurEinser

I have an 08 135i which I initially had trouble 1->2 shifting. Eventually, I got used to the shift by taking that specific shift a bit slow. it was really irritating and embarrassing at first because the people who drove me around asked if I lost my talent for driving manuals. be patient with that one. it is finicky for me too and it took me 3 months to get used to what it needed to not be a jerky shift.

I would say change your trans fluid and then tell me what you think. You will be surprised and shifting like your old self.

[bdaddylo]

Originally Posted by NurEinser

I have an 08 135i which I initially had trouble 1->2 shifting. Eventually, I got used to the shift by taking that specific shift a bit slow. it was really irritating and embarrassing at first because the people who drove me around asked if I lost my talent for driving manuals. be patient with that one. it is finicky for me too and it took me 3 months to get used to what it needed to not be a jerky shift.

+1
Especially if you have a clutch stop there is less play in the clutch so you have to ensure that the clutch is fully disengaged when shifting.

[Venom]

Will do once it's out of warranty in the fall and I'll get back to you. But my previous car was an Acura Integra and shifting was so much smoother in that car. I think it's the differential of torque that took me a bit of getting used to. But now that I am used to it, I love my 1er. I short shifted that Integra way too often so this car is teaching me to be a bit more careful with the clutch.

Originally Posted by Dackelone

I would say change your trans fluid and then tell me what you think. You will be surprised and shifting like your old self.

[blakelocati]

I know this thread is a bit old now, but I thought I would just chime in. I just recently got a 2009 135i 6mt. I have a similar feeling with the shifter. It can be grindy/stiff time from time. Mostly when I am going into second from first, or when I am cruising in like third gear come to a stop with the clutch in and then put it in first at like 5 mph. I don't understand why it does this, but it's sort of annoying. I like the new transmission fluid idea, but I am going to wait until after the warranty is up. Also, I had the BMS clutch stop with two shims in it. I think it was not engaging completely, as it felt a little bit rougher when moving the shifter. Shifts were just as smooth though. Maybe it was just my mind playing tricks on me or has anyone else had similar problems with the clutch stop? I ended up removing all of the shims, and it feels a bit better on engagement, but I'm still unsure. It still does the grinding feel like I said earlier even without the clutch stop. I should add that I have never heard the gears grinding when I shift, just the feel as explained in this thread.

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by blakelocati

I know this thread is a bit old now, but I thought I would just chime in. I just recently got a 2009 135i 6mt. I have a similar feeling with the shifter. It can be grindy/stiff time from time. Mostly when I am going into second from first, or when I am cruising in like third gear come to a stop with the clutch in and then put it in first at like 5 mph. I don't understand why it does this, but it's sort of annoying. I like the new transmission fluid idea, but I am going to wait until after the warranty is up. Also, I had the BMS clutch stop with two shims in it. I think it was not engaging completely, as it felt a little bit rougher when moving the shifter. Shifts were just as smooth though. Maybe it was just my mind playing tricks on me or has anyone else had similar problems with the clutch stop? I ended up removing all of the shims, and it feels a bit better on engagement, but I'm still unsure. It still does the grinding feel like I said earlier even without the clutch stop. I should add that I have never heard the gears grinding when I shift, just the feel as explained in this thread.

You should NEVER do THAT! The only time you should put the car in gear is when the car is stopped. NOT while it is moving. Sure you can do that... but you will wear out your syncros.

A good habit is when coming to a stop say from third gear... push the clutch in just before the engine starts to bog or stall... coast that little bit to a halt... then before engaging 1st gear put the shifter into 2nd gear AND then into 1st gear slot!


As for your notchy rough shifter... it is 80% the trans fluid. You could have a bad or worn trans already. Or even a worn clutch, that is not fully disengaging. But my money is on your trans fluid and CDV. The CDV really makes the 1st 2nd gear changes so much nicer.

IF the car is still under warranty why not ask your dealer to look at it?


Dack

[blakelocati]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

You should NEVER do THAT! The only time you should put the car in gear is when the car is stopped. NOT while it is moving. Sure you can do that... but you will wear out your syncros.

A good habit is when coming to a stop say from third gear... push the clutch in just before the engine starts to bog or stall... coast that little bit to a halt... then before engaging 1st gear put the shifter into 2nd gear AND then into 1st gear slot!


As for your notchy rough shifter... it is 80% the trans fluid. You could have a bad or worn trans already. Or even a worn clutch, that is not fully disengaging. But my money is on your trans fluid and CDV. The CDV really makes the 1st 2nd gear changes so much nicer.

IF the car is still under warranty why not ask your dealer to look at it?


Dack

Thank you so much for telling me that about shifting. I am new to stick, and wasn't aware of that. Only 43k miles on the car, so I doubt it's the clutch. It's probably the CDV and the fluid like you say. Good thing I made that post, because I didn't know it was bad to do that. So, just to confirm, I should shift each gear even if I have the clutch in? Say, I'm in 6th, then I am coming to a stop then go again in second gear before coming to a complete stop, I should be going from 6th to 5th, 5th to 4th, 4th to 3rd, 3rd to 2cd even if I have the clutch in the whole time. Or, is it okay to also put the clutch in, come to a complete stop then 1st gear? that's okay too?

[nachob]

I have gotten this in third gear never in second but it has only happened when rushing the shift. If I slow it down a millisecond no problem.